22 Comments


  1. This is the whole problem with taking history and dogma from the Second Temple studies, we simply cannot trust the Books of Enoch! They are not canon, nor even clear genre and theology? What has happened to trusting the real biblical canon? This is a fad today, nothing more in my opinion.
    Fr. R.

    Reply
    1. Polycarp

      Fr. Robert, where in the world did I take dogma from the 2nd Temple Period or insist that you can trust the Book of Enoch? If you think that I did, then you sorely miss the point of the post in which I note first that Enoch uses Daniel in its sectarian quibbles and because of that, in which Daniel must be recognized as canonical, as with Maccabean books, meaning that contrary to scholarly opinion, Daniel didn’t suddenly appear after the middle of the 2nd century bc but long before.

      I never said anything about not trusting the biblical canon – on the contrary, I used 2nd Temple Theology to showcase that you can trust the biblical canon.

      Reply

  2. Joel,
    I have had to retrace myself as to the whole 2nd Temple ideas, such as in the New Perspective, etc. I am seeing now that NT Wright, is though brilliant, simply going his own way, rather than both NT Pauline theology, and the truth about national Israel.
    Fr. R.

    Reply
    1. Polycarp

      I would agree, Fr. Robert, about Bishop Wright.

      However, my post does not promote his ideas.

      Besides, Dunn seems more in line with certain things than Wright does.

      Reply

      1. Sorry, I am just cleaning house I guess, and the 2nd Temple stuff has got to take some hits, etc. I know my pendulum must be swinging again! I am thinking about that statement…”I only think in Scripture”! Right now that is my thought. Anyway, I don’t like Dunn either! lol He rejects the whole Pauline Corpus, very sad!
        Fr. R.

        Reply
        1. Polycarp

          No, I agree – but I was merely hoping to show that Daniel is clearly written long before 2nd century bc using 2nd Temple documents.

          Dunn is not perfect, but more traditional than Wright. I am not set on NPP, although some of it is interesting.

          Reply

          1. Since I have been on my leave of absence, I have been hammered by my people in the UK (theologians, theolog’s, etc. on e-mails) on this New Pers. and 2d Temple stuff. I had been more toward it at first, but further study and thought has taken me more toward our tradtional Reformed thought again.
            Fr. R.

          2. Polycarp

            Some of it is tempting, but it seems to me that it leads to the abandonment of the Gentile mission and the need for repentance.


          3. Yes, can I say here…we need to get back to our first love?

          4. Polycarp

            Amen to that!

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