Domestic Discipline – If your wife back talks…

This website is intended to be a haven for married couples who practise safe and consensual Christian Domestic Discipline (CDD), or for those who would like to learn more about CDD. It is intended to provide support and encouragement for those who believe in traditional Christian marriage, with the husband as the head of the household, and the wife as his helpmeet.

This website is intended to provide a refuge for those interested in a Christian Domestic Discipline marriage. Here they might find information and share fellowship with other CDD couples without having to wade through pornography, warped practises, or distorted ideals of what we believe God created for marriage. This site is not the typical “spanking” site prevalent on the web. This site focuses mainly upon improving marital relationships by sharing the guidelines and marital roles listed in God’s Word.

And then

The discipline of a master/husband is not based on hitting with fists or fighting in general and in fact is potentially to help avoid improper male aggression and abusiveness of that sort. Instead, the husband has the right to thoughtfully use Biblical chastising to help correct his wife, arguing that it cannot be abuse since God gives merit to human leaders using discipline in the outwork of authority. If authority is to exist at all, the DD (persons using domestic discipline) reasoning goes, it must have consequences to be genuine and not merely a sham. Keep in mind that this is all in the context of a Christian Marriage.

And you know what, it’s not abuse if it is done in God’s name…

In DD terms, it generally would mean any physically harmful hitting. Discipline is FOR the person’s ultimate good, while abuse brings harm to the person.

Read the rest of this garbage – and hope that this is Poe’s Law.

Joel L. Watts holds a Masters of Arts from United Theological Seminary with a focus in literary and rhetorical criticism of the New Testament. He is currently a Ph.D. student at the University of the Free State, analyzing Paul’s model of atonement in Galatians. He is the author of Mimetic Criticism of the Gospel of Mark: Introduction and Commentary (Wipf and Stock, 2013), a co-editor and contributor to From Fear to Faith: Stories of Hitting Spiritual Walls (Energion, 2013), and Praying in God's Theater, Meditations on the Book of Revelation (Wipf and Stock, 2014).

47 thoughts on “Domestic Discipline – If your wife back talks…”

  1. Sadly it is really. CDD is rather common in circles within the United Pentecostal Church, International. Also I have been exposed to this on a variety of levels within the Independent Fundamentalist Baptist churches as well.

  2. Yes, I noticed it a few years ago. Obviously some of the couples were really getting off on it, but two cases were really sad.

    One was a woman who was totally crushed and humiliated by the constant spankings adminstered in the bedroom even during the day when the kids were awake, although in another room. She sounded as if she was quite depressed, as one would expect.

    Another case was where the husband had a case of carpal tunnel syndrome (or something like that) and really had to be coaxed into administering the spankings as a prelude to sex. He sounded pretty worn out.

  3. Oh good heavens! The things that are endorsed or done with “Christian” tacked on are absurd.

    “It is intended to provide support and encouragement for those who believe in traditional Christian marriage, with the husband as the head of the household, and the wife as his helpmeet.” ppfffttttt

  4. ANY suggestions (from anyone!) where to find a man who believes in CDD would be GREATLY appreciated. Any dating sites out there? I’ve visited some sites, that needless to say were on the “undesireable” side of things. I know this is the right lifestyle for me, but am at a loss of where to meet a man (I am in my early 40’s).

  5. Back when my wife and I began dating, the practice that would later become know as “domestic discipline” was simply known as spanking. It was something parents almost always did to children, that boyfriends sometimes did to girlfriends, and that husbands were unofficially permitted to do to their wives. It was simply understood that difficult females never got too old for a spanking.

    Except in instances involving egregious abuse, police did not become involved. Incidental bruising where a woman sat down was not seen as inherently abusive in an age in which were couples expected to privately work out their differences so that their marriages would last for the benefit of society.

    Children generally learned that women could sometimes be spanked by observing and listening to the interaction among older relatives. There were also instances on black and white television and in movies of the day portraying a badly behaved woman over the knee of a man. Although the common spin these days is that onscreen spanking was Hays Code-era sex, the truth is less titillating. Spanking sent a message that there were certain bounds of behavior that were not to be crossed by the fairer sex.

    Although not necessarily commonly practiced, spanking was so acceptable in pre-Sexual Revolution society that my wife and I actually discussed it once we realized that we were falling in love. As a result of our forthright exchange, my wife revealed that she expected to be bent over and soundly spanked for adolescent behaviors whether on a date or at home.

    While chivalry was not universally practiced among couples, it was generally understood that male prerogatives in disciplining females were to be exercised for purely platonic purposes. A female’s vulnerability was not to be exploited gratuitously. Then, as now, that was rape. Although it may seem quite naive these days, walking this fine line laid the foundation for the trust necessary for marital longevity. Nor, might I add, was my wife the only woman of her or her mother’s generation to marry a man after he pulled down her pants and spanked her. Rather than being considered abuse, the initial embarrassment and subsequent unpleasantness was seen as a manifestation of love.

    Although not necessarily cause and effect, marriages became more transient as wife spanking declined. Trust between men and women also descended into the proverbial basement. as marriages became expendable. Along the way, cohabitation and serial monogamy have been elevated to be the equal of marriage. Yet, despite the current trend, there are couples to be found here and there that believe in traditional marriage in which wives willingly promise to obey with the understanding that there will be unpleasant consequences for disobedience. The ancient practice continues. Only the name has changed.

  6. Wow! There are so many people that just don’t get it! CDD is a choice. A choice by both husband and wife! and to be quite frank, it is only their business how they live that choice in life. My wife and I have lived a DD life for most of our 8 years of marriage and we are closer than most of the couples we know. It is a choice we both made and are still making.

    Judge not lest ye be judged.

      1. CDD is a misnomer. Since the practice is no means confined to Christianity, it more traditional than Christian. It just happens than, almost by definition, those of faith tend to be conventional. Furthermore, the Bible is – for the most part at least – a man’s universe. Women are merely along for the ride in a Bronze Age me-Tarzan you-Jane world.

        Even more interesting, various verses in the Bible reveal fixation with reproduction to the extent that sexual acts not likely to lead to conception are either unclean or sin. This attitude toward women is so ingrained in the Christian tradition that an examination of both 17th century Catholic and Protestant literature reveals the notion that any woman not producing as many children as possible is a murderess! Even as late as the early 20th, white women in the United States were expected to produce at least four children!

        Not surprisingly, the above chauvinism spawned the rise of feminism. The ensuing battle of the sexes on steroids still reverberates on the political campaign trail preceding the 2016 presidential election year. Putting women n their place is also playing out in the war over abortion, morning after pill, birth control, and even how much a woman’s labor in the workplace is worth.

  7. I would have to disagree with at least the first portion of your comment. Paul the apostle said that a couple, after spending time apart seeking to be closer to God, should come back together that they would not be tempted to sin. He didn’t say to come together and make babies.

  8. It’s not that I have daddy issues I never got the chance to know him and I grew up without a mother and therefore was raised by uncles with a perverted mind, so no I don’t have daddy issues I have any issues yes everyone does and anyone that says they don’t is a liar, I have issues with trusting people because I was never able to trust anyone when I was growing up even into my adult years, I’ve been through hell and back again more than you can count on your hands and feet and yes if I so desire for my husband when I get married to spank me then that’s what will happen and that’s my prerogative, if you must know spanking is a way to help me to release my emotions that I still have inside that would be healthier for me if they were let out but I don’t know how to let them out and I tried counselors I’ve tried talking to pastors about it and to no avail. Don’t judge a book by its cover you take time to read that book and get to understand that book before you ever make assumptions on what you think there a reason for doing anything is.

  9. My husband and I have been married 4 years. At one time, I was very disrespectful to him. He would ask me to do my part around the house by keeping it tidy and cook for him a few nights a week. I would just roll my eyes and laugh. He was patient, but I could tell it was slowly emasculating him. He talked me into going to a Christian counselor from his parents church. I listened to what the Pastor had to say. He gave me some Bible verses to read about how women should submit to their husband. I began attending a women’s bible study and they talked about how your husband deserves to be treated and must be treated. I also read Christian books about how important it was for the man to be in charge of everything. I decided to treat him like he was my “Master” and did whatever he asked. My husband loved it and our marriage improved. He wanted to try the DD. There are times when I slip and say or do something that I know was wrong. My husband spanks me when I need to be reminded who is the leader of our home. He has a wooden paddle he bought from a sex toy catalogue; We couldn’t find one in regular stores. It hurts when used on my bare bottom, but it gets the message across. Not often, but now & then I get angry and talk back. His belt is used for those times. He whips til I’m crying hard. He says he knows its painful, but the pain is to help me remember. I’m glad for his guidance and love to help correct my behavior.

      1. Mr. Watts, I know it sounds like abuse. He wouldn’t have to punish me if I wasn’t disobedient. After the deserved spankings & yes, occasional belt lashing, he comforts me. We will read Bible verses about women’s submission to her husband. He loves me enough to follow God’s commands for our married life. God made my husband & you, Joel, leaders! When he corrects my disrespect it’s Biblical. Tonite when he comes home, he & I know I will be whipped b/c I withheld sex from him last night. I was selfish. The Bible states my body is his possession. He could have taken me by force, but didn’t. I, as a woman, know I am to satisfy my husbands sexual needs. He will strip me, have me lie face down on our bed & he will strike me w/ 75 lashes. We AGREED that is a fair amount for my disobedience! He strips me to make me feel the humiliation he felt. Afterward, I will do my wifely duty & satisfy him sexually. I know the pain will be horrific, but I brought this pain on myself.

          1. POE’S LAW:

            “Without a winking smiley or other blatant display of humor, it is uttrerly [sic] impossible to parody a Creationist in such a way that someone won’t mistake for the genuine article.”

            Nathan Poe
            August 11, 2005
            http://www.christianforums.com/t1962980-6/#post17606580

            Meanwhile, the problem with trying to outlaw spanking females is fourfold.

            First, longstanding customs typically survive attempts to outlaw them. Blackstone cited the custom of domestic chastisement in his 18th century treatise Commentaries on the Laws of England. The practice was brought to North America by English settlers even before that. There was at least one recorded 17th century sectioning a Massachusetts husband punishing his abusive wife. Although the means were not specified in the written record, chastisement is among the more suspected remedies.

            By the 19th century, legal presidents concerning moderate restraint in the United State waffled. Through the Victorian era and through most of the 20th century, while obvious abuse was usually considered criminal, spanking was at least unofficially permitted. The practice as so widespread that one widely circulated mid-20th century marital counseling texts noted that some wives were willing participants! Therefore, the same text went on to advise professionals to not interfere unless there were extenuating circumstances.

            It was not until after passage of federal equal rights legislation that spanking was reclassified as “domestic violence” – a term that did not exist before the mid-1970s. With no statistical proof to validate the assumption, counselors were nonetheless trained that spanking was a gateway to abuse.

            Second, unlike boys, there is no point beyond which spanking ceases to, temporarily at least, make girls behave themselves. Thus, while more affluent parents manage their older daughters through access to birth control, counseling, lawyers, money, and privileges, less affluent parents still spank their older daughters. Conflicts exist because, as the Bible correctly points out, the rules of the game are written by the rich.

            Until the 1970s, it was fairly common for girls to marry in their teens. (Statistically, this is translates into the difference between average and median age of first marriage for a female cohort.) Prior to that time, it was not uncommon for teenage daughters living at home to still be spanked by her parents. Even girls going to college were not exempted from this parental authority.

            At the same time, early 20th century husbands were typically 3 or 4 years older than their brides. Thus, as the old expression went, these husbands tended to pick up where the girl’s parents left off. While early 21st century females marrying later and being closer to the same age as their husbands has mitigated behavioral problems associated with immaturity, it has not eliminated them. Some wives still expect husbands, as pointed out in Genesis, to literally “rule over” them the old-fashioned way. This may, or may not have anything to do with whether the wife was spanked as a child!

            Third, along with several other socially defining issues, spanking females is more accepted in some cultural and ethnic contexts than it is in others. As always, while there are exceptions, those of Northern European extraction are typically more averse to the practice than are some other demographics. This seems to be particularly true as one moves south and east.

            The above is important because the anti-spanking movement in the United States is largely a late 20th century white phenomenon. As the country approaches the middle of the 21st century, if present trends continue, the influence of the white populace will diminish by supplanting and interbreeding. (As anthropologists noted decades ago, race classification is a cataloging scheme devoid of scientific base. Only recently has the general public begun to reach the same conclusion.)

            Fourth, despite recent attempts to classify spanking as abusive, Christian (fundamentalist), or pornographic, it remains elusive for various reasons. Not all spanked women feel abused. Nor are all couples engaged in the practice conservative, much less Christian fundamentalists. Finally, as with copulation, obscenity is largely in the eyes of the beholder.

  10. It is not supported. I as the wife WANTING this in my marriage and bringing this to my husband when we started over 20 years ago researched churches and still do. I was raised in a CDD home and my parents had the BEST marriage! It is very popular in the UK but it is not particular to ANY religion and the UPCI does NOT support or recognize. If you do not believe me, ask them. Call a few churches and speak to the minister of that church and you will see I am telling the honest truth.

    In Christ,
    Shirley

  11. It is not a Christian S&M site. It is a site for folks that truly believe in Christian Domestic Discipline. It is not about sex but about everyday living. I know this because my husband and I practice. There is no bondage. There is no collars or ball gags or anything like that. We have rules in our marriage and yes, if need be I am disciplined in a very loving nurturing way. It has brought us close together and we NEVER argue and have a great sex life. We cherish our marriage and each other and even if he is upset with something or I have broken a rule and am to be disciplined, again it is always done lovingly and private.

    If you wold like to know more, I would have no problems answering any questions. It is bothersome when folks blast something they have never tried, or even worse form an opinion on something they really know very little about. Again, any questions you would like answered, I will gladly do so. I have NEVER been abused and truly believe in being obedient to my husband. I love that he puts me and our children first and always will. I love that I can go to him with ANYTHING and know he will figure it out. He is a leader by nature and I follow his lead. It is very harmonious to say the least. We have great marriage, lots of love in our home and do conduct a Bible study in our home. While this is not practiced at large, there are a few members of our church that believe in CDD as well and do practice. Again, if you have the facts and post, then so be it, but I kind of felt beaten up after reading this and really wanted to correct the Christian S&M comment!!

    Best wishes on where ever life leads you.

    In Christ,
    Shirley Stanley

  12. Thanks Mrs. Shirley Stanley for sharing your thoughts on CDD I’m not married yet and I know that I will in the future and thought that I was wierd for wanting this quality in my future husband only because of the trust issues I have and sometimes I can get a little out of hand I am 30 now and sometimes wish that I could get spanked to help me stay on track and focused you have helped me a lot with just sharing your testimony

  13. As Matthew 7:1 points out, judgmentalism can be a two-edged sword.

    A decade ago, sociology professor Ken Ferraro published research finding a statistical correlation between religious faith and excessive body mass index (BMI). In other words, faith and fat go together. More recently, biopsychology professor Nigel Barber concluded that not only are atheists brighter than believers, eventually atheism will replace religion in number of adherents.

    Given the above, does this mean you cling to religion because you’re fat, stupid, and an evolutionary dead end?

  14. Abuse is in the eyes of the beholder in a nation where, in some jurisdictions, even slamming a door can be construed as abusive.

    More to the point, your pat pulpit pabulum isn’t all the different from a Catholic nun informing parochial students that homosexuality is caused by weak fathers when, truth be told, no one is quite sure what causes it. (After word got out, the diocese had the good sense to remove the nun from her instructional duties.) As a medical doctor once explained – absent his more explicit language – no one suddenly wakes up one morning with an urge to have a penis shoved up their rectum!

    Anyone with a rudimentary knowledge of social sciences is aware that human behavior is much too complex to be adequately explained by single causalities that, all too often, are the modern equivalent of “He hath a devil.” Those buying into simplistic explanations usually wind up looking like fools a few generations later. A hundred years ago, some of the more radical elements in the temperance crowd blamed wars on alcohol. More recently, some less cerebral opponents of spanking children blamed the practice for school shootings.

    Given the above, it behooves advice givers and decision makers to keep in mind what United States judge and judicial philosopher Learned Hand once observed about error. Beginning with a famous quote from Oliver Cromwell, the judge said: “‘I beseech ye in the bowels of Christ, think that ye may be mistaken.’ I should like to have that written over the portals of every CHURCH, every school, and every courthouse, and, may I say, of every legislative body in the United States. I should like to have every court begin, I beseech ye in the bowels of Christ, I think we may be mistaken.” (Emphasis added.)

    At best, merely telling a young woman that she has “daddy issues” is the intellectual equivalent of gay therapy. It’s a way of patronizingly admonishing her, “Get over it.” Even if true, which I have no way of knowing one way or the other, the simplistic labeling offers her no insight into how to go about dealing with her desire. More disturbingly, the brushoff reminds me of the (with what I’m really thinking here omitted) draft-dodging pastoral counselors telling recently returned and unemployed Vietnam veterans to stop whining and get a job. Now, after Iraq and Afghanistan, most sane counselors know better than to dispense such simplistic advice.

    Much as you may disagree, the best therapy for the presumably young woman to whom responded may be to get herself spanked by a fiance or husband that really cares about her. (I frankly admit I don’t know because I know neither her nor her situation.) In any case, it’s her choice (as in pro-choice) rather than yours.

  15. Church history clearly proves that the Bible can be used to justify many practices that others find objectionable. Probably among the best examples is 17th century British politics.

  16. As with locking criminals up and throwing away the key (the current criminal justic e model), society needs to differentiate between that which is truly harmful or dangerous, and that with which it disagrees.

    For example, while I personally oppose recreational drug use and would just love to get rid of the stuff (including tobacco), statistical analysis reveals mass incarcerations for smoking pot are far more damaging to society actual pot smoking. For example, recent crime statistics released by the City of Denver shows a decided DECREASE in most categories of both property and violent crime since that city’s governing board legalized recreational marijuana sales. Only one category of theft went up. Everything else decreased!

    Not covered by the Denver statistics is an most likely decrease in costs associated with arrest and booking, pretrial detention, court costs, prison costs (which, on a per annum basis for long-term inmates, rival costs associated with annual tuition costs at an exclusive private college)!

    By the way, I can’t find that verse in the Bible that explicitly forbids child molestation. Neither can I find the one specifically prohibiting a man from spanking his wife!

  17. yes, but you can find verses condoning rape.

    I am not a biblicalist. My morals and ethics are drawn from Scripture, but move past it.

    Oh, and the verse about millstones… the rabbis used that against child molesters.

  18. While it’s your choice to make the accusation, the difference is that her practices does not impinge on your right to not spank your wife any more than homosexual marriage adversely affects heterosexual marriage. (At least, so far as I can tell, gay marriage hasn’t ruined the marriage to my wife of several decades.) On the other hand, labeling is little more than high-class playground name calling.

  19. Howbeit from a different source, I read about this a day or two ago. Gohmert reminds me of a town drunk being elected to town council and not knowing when to keep his mouth shut.

  20. When you have time, you might want to watch the controversial documentary Are All Men Pedophiles?

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