Arnold Murray: Secret Identity


SPLCenter.org: Secret Identity.

It’s a long way to go to church, especially for a congregation used to watching its pastor on television. But the flock of Shepherd’s Chapel is like no other. Twice a year, almost 4,000 of its members will fly or drive from points across the country to this Ozarks tourist destination, best known for the neon kitsch and wholesome family entertainment of the Highway 76 Country Music Boulevard, to see Pastor Arnold Murray, host of the long-running TV Bible study program, “Shepherd’s Chapel.

The strapping, 6-foot-4-inch octogenarian, known as “The Sarge” to his followers, has gained an audience that numbers in the millions. “Shepherd’s Chapel” has been on the air for at least three decades and is broadcast in nearly every major and mid-size U.S. city.

At Passover this April 5 (Murray calculates the date for Passover according to his own interpretation of the Jewish calendar), the 81-year-old Arkansas pastor is all smiles as the packed audience in the Grand Palace country music hall rises to give him a long standing ovation before he’s even said a word. His son Dennis introduces him as a man who is “taking names and kicking dragons.” One woman can’t contain herself. “We love you, Pastor Murray,” she yells out. Murray jokes that he should get her number before pushing back his sleeves and opening his King James Bible. “Let’s get to work,” he commands. And they do. The audience is so rapt that throughout the 45-minute sermon the only sound they make is the onionskin rustle of thousands of Bible pages turning. But there are some things they’re not being taught.


One of them is the fact that Murray’s 1958 minister’s license was signed by the late white supremacists Roy Gillaspie and Kenneth Goff, two early ideologues of Christian Identity, a racist theology that’s been popular among Klansmen, neo-Nazis and other white nationalists for several decades. Most Identity adherents believe the Bible is the history of the white race, who are seen as the real “chosen people.”

Gillaspie was the pastor of the Church of Jesus Christ, a seminal Christian Identity operation — headquartered at Gillaspie’s Bellflower, Calif., church — with a handful of congregations in California and Arkansas, one of which was led by Murray. (Murray’s Church of Jesus Christ in Gravette, Ark., was the precursor to his Shepherd’s Chapel, in the same location.) The Intelligence Report has obtained Church of Jesus Christ newsletters dated 1978 that are signed by Murray.

Goff, for his part, was the founder of the Colorado-based Soldiers of the Cross Training Institute, a school that trained Christian Identity leaders including Dan Gayman, a well-known anti-Semitic leader during the 1980s. In 1958, Goff’s pamphlet, “Reds Promote Racial War,” claimed the Bible supported racial segregation. A 1969 Soldiers of the Cross newsletter penned by Goff describes black civil rights protesters as seeking “to submerge our culture and religious heritage under a flood of cannibalism, voodooism and beastly jungle sex orgies.”

Arnold Murray is still connected to something called Soldiers of the Cross. According to Arkansas public records, a corporation by that name is doing business as Shepherd’s Chapel in Arkansas, and Murray is registered as the corporation’s agent. Murray’s home, his church property where the TV studio and satellites are located, and several parcels of land in Gravette, Ark., are all listed as the property of Soldiers of the Cross.

Despite these ties to the roots of the Christian Identity movement, Murray today publicly disavows racism, and his followers include a tiny minority of non-whites. Even so, Murray preaches often about a race of evil people, descended from Cain, borne out of “the Serpent Seed” of Eve’s sexual union with Satan in the Garden of Eden. He calls them the “Kenites” and identifies them in his 1979 Shepherd’s Bible as people “who slipped in among the Jewish people in Jerusalem and claim to be God’s chosen people, when in fact they are of Lucifer.” He also mentions that “in 1967 … Jerusalem fell to the Kenites during the 6 day war”; the Israelis, in fact, won the Six-Day War. In one sermon, Dennis Murray speaks of “the Kenites, who are responsible for the slaying of Christ.” (In most Judeo-Christian traditions, the Kenites are a nomadic clan of Midianites and a tribe into which Moses married.)

The Serpent Seed is a belief ripped straight from the pages of “seedline” or “two-seed” Christian Identity theology, the hard-line version of the theology that holds that Eve was impregnated by Satan and gave birth to his son, Cain, described as the first Jew. That is, Jews are seen as biologically descended from Satan, and are allegedly hard at work preparing the earth for his rule. Identity adherents also argue that whites, not Jews, are the real Hebrews of the Bible, and that non-whites are sub-human “beasts of the field” created without souls.

While Murray doesn’t outright endorse these hardliner views, by promoting the “Serpent Seed” doctrine on 225 broadcast stations he’s gone further than any Christian Identity preacher in pushing what seem clearly to be anti-Semitic Identity teachings into the mainstream.

“This is certainly Identity theology, inasmuch as he presents a two-seedline argument, identifies the [present] inhabitants of Israel with the descendants of Cain, and calls the mating of the Serpent with Eve the primal sin,” Michael Barkun, the leading scholar of Christian Identity and a political science professor at Syracuse University, told the Intelligence Report.

Or, as Murray puts it more cautiously on his website: “What about teaching Serpent Seed? I make no apology for teaching the word of God.”

Kenites, Cainites and the Jews
In the atrium of the Grand Palace, a stately country music hall, teenagers are as common as senior citizens. Southern drawls mix with Wisconsin and Southern Californian accents. About two dozen black families are in the audience as well as a white woman wearing a pink hoodie with the words “Homeland Security” superimposed on a photo of four armed American Indians.Over the course of the weekend, the Murrays will anoint two dozen babies with oil and baptize 83 adults and teenagers next door, in the indoor pool of the Radisson Hotel. There’s a rock concert feel to the weekend, both intense and oddly impersonal for a religious gathering. When either of the Murrays’ sermons end, his followers quietly file out of their chairs and make their way back to the parking lot, only briefly loitering for conversation or fellowship.

Rarely does a month go by without the elder Murray warning his followers about the Kenites. “Bless your heart if you have ever been deceived by the Kenite, and I am speaking now on the spiritual level, if you have ever really believed that group was the chosen of God, you were deceived by Satan,” Murray says in one popular audio tape sermon. “Repent of that even more so than your personal sins in the personal sense.”

Although Murray states on his website, “Anyone saying that I use the word [Kenites] to describe Judah is not telling the truth,” it’s not hard to figure out why many of his followers — and others — equate Kenites with Jews.

In one written sermon, Murray says that “the Kenites slipped in among the Jews.” In an audiotape sermon called “Demons,” he says of the Kenites, “Why do you think their own Talmud is the filthiest piece of literature ever written? Because they’re at home with it. They love it. It’s their cup of tea. It’s Satan’s cup of tea.”

“Murray is a bit distinctive in one respect, and that is the emphasis on ‘Kenites,’” Barkun, the scholar, told the Report. “None of the central figures in the formation of Christian Identity … speak of the Kenites. Rather, they discuss descendants of Cain and sometimes Cainites. … However, there appears to be a small number of Identity pastors who trace Biblical genealogy from Cain through the Kenites (were they somehow attracted by the similar sounds of the names?).

“Murray is obviously one.”

For their part, longtime Shepherd’s Chapel students, seeking to avoid what they feel is Satanic deceit, believe they must learn how to “identify” a Kenite. On Internet forums where Shepherd’s Chapel followers congregate, there is much debate over the racial identity of the Kenites. On a Shepherd’s Chapel MySpace group, some ask whether the Kenites might be of Asian ancestry. But over on TheSeason.org, a long-running forum for Shepherd’s Chapel students, there’s little ambivalence. Numerous essays, citing the anti-Semitic hoax, The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, claim that the Kenites and the Jews have long plotted world domination.

For Some, Disillusionment
Paul Stringini, a former Shepherd’s Chapel student, told the Intelligence Report that Murray “promotes what I would call soft resentment against Jews.” “He’ll say he loves the Jews, it’s the Kenites he doesn’t like,” say Stringini. “Just try and nail him down on it. There’s a semantic game that goes on. Frankly, the only real ‘benefit’ which I have ever seen of knowing ‘who the Kenites are’ is that knowledge makes many people prejudiced against Jews … assuming they are ‘Kenites.’ I know that is not explicitly what Pastor Murray teaches but that is what it does to many Shepherd’s Chapel students I have known.”Stringini knows he’s not alone among former Shepherd’s Chapel students who left in disgust over Murray’s Serpent Seed theology. But whatever students Murray may lose are quickly replaced, thanks to his coast-to-coast TV and radio presence. That’s how Stringini got involved with Shepherd’s Chapel in 1993. In 1995, he was baptized in a hotel pool at the group’s Branson Passover. “By 1996, I owned and had studied every single-subject cassette available at the time,” wrote Stringini. He even married his wife at the Shepherd’s Chapel headquarters in Arkansas.

But the more he heard from Murray about the “trumpets” of the end times and the “evil” of the Kenites, the less it rang true. Stringini quit Shepherd’s Chapel in 1999 and remains one of the few former Murray followers willing to publicly criticize his ex-mentor, though he says that when Arnold Murray is not talking about the apocalypse or Kenites, “he’s actually a pretty decent Bible teacher.”

Unlike unapologetic Identity preachers, Murray doesn’t condone or suggest violence against the “Kenites.” “Let’s get one thing straight, coming out the gate. Are you saying we should hate Judah? That would be stupid indeed,” he says in one recorded sermon. Instead, Murray encourages followers to focus their energy on identifying and avoiding Kenites, claiming an end-times event will “take care” of them. In “Kenites,” a widely distributed audio sermon, he claims this teaching comes directly from Jesus. Murray uses the New Testament parable of the “tares,” a bitter weed that Jesus warns can grow hidden in wheat fields and go unnoticed till harvest. Murray likens the tares to the Kenites, adding, “The angels will take care of the tares — the tares are taken together in the fire — that’s the end of the world — that’s how it’s going to be.”

For Murray, the end of the world isn’t an abstraction. The 1980 Mount St. Helens eruption that happened during the week of Pentecost led him to proclaim the Antichrist would return in 1981. Murray’s resolve has only hardened during the 27 years since that prophecy failed to come true. He dismisses his critics as “numbskulls,” “Bible-thumpers” and “yo-yos.”

The formula for his TV program is deceptively simple. “Verse by verse, chapter by chapter,” Murray, often partnered with his son Dennis, sits between a wood desk and an American flag and interprets the King James Bible with the help of a Greek/Hebrew concordance. At the end of each show, he fields caller questions on global politics, end-times prophecy and scripture.

During a live taping of Shepherd’s Chapel in 1998, an audience member yelled, “Blasphemer!” Murray turned around at his desk and pulled out a gun. The broadcast cut to Shepherd’s Chapel’s satellite logo but the audio continued. “Here. Take this 9mm to that boy,” Murray said. The clip aired on “The Daily Show” and remains widely available on the Internet, as is another Shepherd’s Chapel clip in which Murray reaches into his desk and pulls out what he claims is the fossil of an angel footprint, from a pre-Adamic time when angels walked the earth.

Under the Radar
Despite his gaffes with guns and failed end-time prophecies, Murray has received very little attention in the mainstream press. In the mid-1990s the Arkansas Democrat-Gazette did briefly examine whether Murray’s airplanes, which he claims are used in the nonprofit religious mission of Shepherd’s Chapel, were in fact private vehicles and therefore taxable assets. But it did not delve into the nature or origins of Murray’s theological teachings.Few chapel students will ever attend services at the actual Shepherd’s Chapel in Gravette, a tiny and remote town of 1,800 in far northwest Arkansas. Located just a couple of blocks from the town’s main street, the headquarters chapel is a former roller rink, flanked by four satellites, one the size of a carousel. A stone plaque that reads, “I Am That I Am,” sits in front of the church. The chapel holds videotaped services on the first and third Sunday of every month. As with his live appearances at the Passover in Branson this April, Murray seldom lingers on stage to chat with or greet his followers after his sermon concludes.

“I’m a very private person, almost a loner,” Murray says in one audiotape sermon. Murray says he prefers the outdoors and maintains an intensely private life on a wooded 30-acre property in rural Benton County, Ark. Few biographical details are known about the pastor. Born in 1927, Murray grew up in a farming family. On the Shepherd’s Chapel site, he says he served in the Korean War as a Marine. He also claims to have received a doctorate, though he doesn’t name the institution. Murray almost never gives media interviews and did not respond to requests for comment for this story. But he has addressed some of those who criticize him.

In a Shepherd’s Chapel website post called “An Answer to Our Critics,” Murray says: “To say I teach racism or practice racism is another outright lie. We have people of all races that attend and study with the Shepherd’s Chapel.” While that may be true, Shepherd’s Chapel’s supporters who defend their church as non-racist have some former colleagues among white supremacists. On the neo-Nazi website Stormfront, an array of former Murray students who now pray and pastor at hard-core Christian Identity churches, have weighed in on Murray’s anti-Semitic credentials. “Yep, Murray is ‘lukewarm,’ he is half right, which makes him all dangerous,” wrote “NC patriot.” Another poster going by the handle “Artemis Clydefrog” stated: “I’ve been studying with the Chapel for about 15 years. He’s not C.I. [Christian Identity], but he does teach the ‘Serpent’s Seed.’” “[Murray] believes that blacks are exactly the same as Whites in the eyes of God,” said Stormfront poster “LeBrune” with evident disapproval. “Just because he teaches about the “Serpent’s Seed,” don’t think for a moment that he is a White Nationalist, promotes Christian Identity, White Separation, or even White Preservation.”

But a 1997 complaint filed with the Federal Communications Commission, which regulates broadcast media, argued otherwise. Shepherd’s Chapel’s broadcasts were one of the subjects of a complaint by former media company MediaOne (now part of AT&T) against Georgia’s WNGM-TV in a dispute over market access. MediaOne alleged that “Shepherd’s Chapel,” then carried on WNGM-TV, “has purveyed racist dogma,” citing claims by the program on Nov. 13 and 15, 1996, that “not all races can come from Adam and Eve,” that “God created different races … and that’s the way he wanted us to stay,” and that the Biblical flood “was to destroy those [of different races] who had intermixed.”

With the exception of New York City, “Shepherd’s Chapel” airs in every major market in the country, in one- to four-hour slots, usually between midnight and six a.m. For hardcore fans, a 24-hour, seven-day a-week satellite broadcast of Shepherd’s Chapel is available on DirecTV. A prophecy hotline is also available where callers can listen to a two-minute loop of Murray’s commentary on events of the day.

All that airtime doesn’t come cheap. In 1990, the Arkansas-Democrat Gazette reported that Murray spent $75,000 a month on television time. Where all that money comes from remains a mystery. Arkansas churches are shielded by state law from having to disclose their finances like other nonprofits. Unlike other, more notorious televangelists, the Murrays rarely make direct appeals for funds. At Passover in Branson, a single discreet tithing box was unmanned in the main room.

But many Shepherd’s Chapel students are all too happy to donate to their pastor. For them, he’s often the first and only religious figure to have walked them through the Bible verse by verse. Buying his books and sermons, or directly donating, seems less like tithing to them and more like paying tuition.

But at the Passover in Branson, if they listened closely, students could hear snippets of a theology that probably was more than they bargained for, like when Dennis Murray blamed the Kenites for the crucifixion of Jesus. “I’d like to see them crawling around the floor picking up their blood money,” Dennis Murray said of the people his father still insistently claims are not the Jews, despite all appearances. “That’d be a picture.”

Post By Joel Watts (10,050 Posts)

Joel L. Watts holds a Masters of Arts from United Theological Seminary with a focus in literary and rhetorical criticism of the New Testament. He is currently a Ph.D. student at the University of the Free State, analyzing Paul’s model of atonement in Galatians. He is the author of Mimetic Criticism of the Gospel of Mark: Introduction and Commentary (Wipf and Stock, 2013), a co-editor and contributor to From Fear to Faith: Stories of Hitting Spiritual Walls (Energion, 2013), and Praying in God's Theater, Meditations on the Book of Revelation (Wipf and Stock, 2014).

Website: → Unsettled Christianity

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335 thoughts on Arnold Murray: Secret Identity

  1. One thing I have learned is a good translation is important. I use a KJ Companion Bible but I have several translations, as well as a Strong’s exhaustive concordance.
    But if you, as you say, find the Bible wanting, then maybe your problem is with either/or God or misunderstanding God and the Bible doesn’t make sense to you.
    “Fruit” is figurative speech just as the Tree of Life
    is representative of Christ.
    Being taught that Eve ate a fruit and was punished makes God sound mean, when he gave the regular fruit to be eaten. It wasn’t fruit per se but ..remember reading this? You will know them by their fruit??
    God also compares himself to a evergreen tree and a blind man that was healed, at first, saw men walking as trees. There is lots of figurative language in
    the Bible as well as passages where God changes the subject briefly. Like when we talk, we sometimes change the subject and then go back to the former subject.
    You need to study for yourself, Polycarp.
    You may think you’re doing a good work but you would really know for sure if you read and study the Bible instead of slamming PM and SC.

  2. PC; I said
    “Fruit” is figurative speech just as the Tree of Life
    is representative of Christ.
    Just as….I said…giving you an example of figurative speech used in the Bible.
    Ditto for you and reading skills…
    Eve ate of the tree of good and evil which was of the devil.
    We disagree as to who or what the tree of good and evil was/is, whereas, we do not disagree with who the Tree of Life is.
    3 persons were punished after the incident; Adam, Eve and the serpent. Read carefully what God said to the serpent. One of the tall tales is believing the serpent was a magical snake. And the tree of good and evil also was pretty magical as trees go…hmmmm…..
    I do study for myself, PC, I trust no man but I trust God. Fortunately, I answet to God not man for my salvation.

  3. I never said that the Bible covered up anything.
    I do say that the Bible is not a dry history lesson. It says that God would put
    enmity between the serpent and the woman; her seed and the serpent’s seed. Now, many religions would have you believe that God didn’t mean that literally. And why not? In Matt. Jesus is talking to the leaders of the church and said plainly that their father was the devil. Again, many churches will tell you the Jesus was just kiddin’, it was just figuratively speaking.
    Oh yeah? Where do they get that? And the parable, translated to the apostles about the seed; the devil planted evil seed in the world. Many churches will tell you that the parable he translated wasn’t literal.
    Where is the proof that you are right and I am wrong.
    Listen, these sites that slam pastor Murray are not believeable except to the ignorant. Anyone that has listened to pastor Murray for some time, will learn that YES, he does believe in 3 persons in one GOD, NO, he is not a racist, Yes, he believes in self defense and so do I, he doesn’t beg for money. That right there deserves a medal. When’s the last time you slammed a preacher that spends all his air time begging for money? I thought not.
    You don’t want to listen to him, one word: Don’t.
    What’s it to yah?

  4. Kenites are sons of Cain.
    Know anyone that is the son of Cain?
    I don’t honestly know for 100% sure what color they are, as that’s not really an issue. I also don’t know how many male kenites there are compared to female kenites. Does that make me a sexist?
    The “seed” is Christ? Then it is figurative speech to you.
    Insulting me accomplishes nothing. It only diminishes you and as for me…I’m moving on….
    Average Bear

  5. Again,,, putting your trust in Man,, be he preacher or not.. God said to put your trust in him and NOT Man….. sounds like you guys are worshiping Murray instead of the Father… tread lightly, read the Bible for yourself,don’t put all your trust in Man… Any one that teaches Racism,is not called of God…all I have to say…

  6. I believe that Arnold Murray’s other son defends his father’s racist cult on the internet and goes by a cyber moniker as “smyrna” as well as hundreds of other pseudonyms. All in the family.

    • yes he has another son david no one will tell where he is or what ahppend to him

      • Hey, “Mr. King,” – Keep the vulgarity off of my platform. With every defense of of Murray, more vulgarity is to ensue, but the other, the profanity, don’t do it.

        Oh, and Murray is a devil.

  7. I’m sure some of the posters above are him. He never goes anywhere on the net without his self created cheerleader squad. He will do anything to destroy anyone who speaks negatively about Arnold Murray.

  8. I saw on your web site that your doctorine beleives in speaking in tongues. There is a pastor on TV named K. Thomas who speaks in tongues so could you tell me what he is saying. To me it sounds like nonsense.

  9. Here is what Arnold has to say about racism!

    In Answer to Critics
    by Pastor Arnold B. Murray

    I make it a policy to never mention individual denominations, groups or single out individuals by name; however since 1991 several so called “Christian Research” organizations have willingly quoted each others’s falsehoods and labels, without direct research, until they are blindly printing outright lies. This has gone on long enough now that I have categorized some glaring examples of such inaccuracies to facilitate making a clear Biblical response. I am not writing this document because I seek nor want any organization’s endorsement, but I wish to point out these inaccuracies for intelligent Bible students who love to study God’s Word. The Shepherd’s Chapel Network now has millions of serious Bible students who study daily with us. It is because I love each of you who desire a deeper study into our Father’s Word that I feel I owe this response to you and especially to new students of the Shepherd’s Chapel.

    I also should point out to those not familiar with the Shepherd’s Chapel that we are completely independent; therefore we are not affiliated with any other church, denomination or group. As a matter of record, the only group of which I am a member is with the “Chosin Few” which is a group of Korean War veterans comprised of various military factions who fought in one of the more famous battles of that war. I am very proud to have served as a U.S. Marine in this severe winter battle in which approximately 12,000 of our troops faced a massive surprise attack by an estimated 120,000 of the Chinese communist enemy. Although suffering many casualties, the Marines and our British allies inflicted far more damage to the Chinese and were able to ultimately escape (with our dead and injured) from the Chosin Reservoir where we were at a grave disadvantage. Despite being wounded I survived this war because, I believe, the Lord had further plans and a purpose for my life. I have never forgotten the discipline of the U.S. Marine Corps and the lessons learned in war. If I teach like a Marine DI (Drill Instructor) it is with love because I know first hand the value of well educated and trained troops. In fact the root word behind the word “disciples” is “discipline”. The Bible frequently uses military terms to convey how we must prepare to face spiritual warfare. As Christians our ultimate enemy is not “flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places, to wit we must put on the whole armour of God” (Ephesians 6:10-19).

    I believe many of the inaccurate perceptions of what I teach at the Shepherd’s Chapel could be resolved quickly if those interested would simply request our “Statement of Faith” which has been freely available for many years. If you have not already requested it I would encourage you to do so. But perhaps the best way to evaluate what I teach is to simply listen for a while. One thing you will quickly notice is that I like to field questions which in my opinion is a fine way for the listener to test what is being taught. Since the beginning of my Bible teaching ministry, over 50 years ago, I have always insisted on taking questions from the congregation. This important part of teaching ensures that everyone has an opportunity to ask key questions, then hear and judge the knowledge of the teacher for themselves. Now let’s take a look at some of the usual points of criticism that some of these so-called “Christian Research” people seem to steal from one another in their rush to reproduce lies against myself and the Shepherd’s Chapel.

    The Trinity or Godhead

    I teach YHVH (“I Am That I Am” and Hebrew for the Sacred Name of God), Yahshua (Hebrew for God’s Saviour Jesus) and the Holy Spirit. When you speak the Truth it is the Holy Spirit manifesting Himself through you. Matthew 10:20 explicitly says “For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.” The meaning, of course, refers to the Holy Spirit as in Mark 13:11 which notes, “but when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do you premeditate; but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye; for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost (Spirit).” I make no apology for teaching the Godhead in this manner, and I certainly do not need an endorsement or approval or further interpretation of my words from any man or group of research witch hunters.

    Also, I have never taught that men were little gods. It would be a lie for someone to say so. I do teach all souls were created by our Father. A Christian that would not teach this fact would have a big problem with Scripture. Example: Jeremiah 1:5 says, “Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and ordained thee a prophet unto the nations. Another example: Ephesians 1:4 says, “According as He hath chosen us in Him before the foundation of the world.”

    Recommended additional study lectures on audio CD:

    #30574, “Nature of God, El Shaddai
    #30417, “Elect”

    Racism

    To say that I teach racism or practice racism is another outright lie. We have people of all races that attend and study with the Shepherd’s Chapel. It is very simple to prove this statement. We televise our annual Passover meetings including video interviews of many of the thousands who attend. Order a video tape of any of these interviews and you will see people of all races which effectively documents the falseness of any charges that I teach racism (a sample of Passover Interviews is also offered at the end of this document). God’s Word directly teaches that our Heavenly Father created all the races and that it was good, (Genesis 1:27-28, 31). People of all nations and races shall be in the Temple of the Lord throughout eternity (Revelation 21:22-27).

  10. Racism

    To say that I teach racism or practice racism is another outright lie. We have people of all races that attend and study with the Shepherd’s Chapel. It is very simple to prove this statement. We televise our annual Passover meetings including video interviews of many of the thousands who attend. Order a video tape of any of these interviews and you will see people of all races which effectively documents the falseness of any charges that I teach racism (a sample of Passover Interviews is also offered at the end of this document). God’s Word directly teaches that our Heavenly Father created all the races and that it was good, (Genesis 1:27-28, 31). People of all nations and races shall be in the Temple of the Lord throughout eternity (Revelation 21:22-27).

  11. Arnold Murray has falsely claimed that the two groups of Jews that comprise 95% of all who consider themselves to be Jews, the Ashkenazim and the Sephardim, are actually “Kenites”, literal descendants of Satan…. THAT IS RACIST AS WELL AS ANTISEMITIC. Murray has twisted the Bible to say that blacks, orientals and non German and Celtic whites are not descended from Adam and Eve but instead some nameless subhuman creations before Adam and Eve and THAT IS RACIST! And if you believe the perversions of the Bible that Murray preaches then YOU ARE RACIST!

    The only lies are Murray’s. No matter how many times Murray proclaims he is not a racist it matters not. The evidence is clear by his own words. Arnold Murray is a RACIST!

  12. Deb, this isn’t about putting anyone before “God”. This site is about someone making up lies about a man and men and woman speaking out against the lies.

    Polycarp, you seem to think you know about Paster Arnold Murray. But, the people that know him say you don’t. How can you refuse to believe someone’s opinions and truths?

    After reading this article, and your blog, I see that you are looking for a fight. You don’t preach the Word, nor do you study the Word. You throw out your acquisitions with your one verse, ripped from the Bible into your blog, there and the rest of your articles are backed up with a lot of hoopla.

    So, you want to be known for your words. Paster Murray doesn’t want to be in the spotlight. He proves it by not letting his private life go on display as so many others have, before him, in broadcasting.

    Those of us who have studied the Bible through Paster Murray know how you’ve twisted the truth above.

    You want something to argue about? Start with President Obama and how his actions go against his words. You won’t be held so accountable when the time comes.

    E.T.

  13. You quoted a different parable in Luke, where seeds are put for something else. That’s not how they are used in Matt 13. That’s why Paul told Timothy to rightly…oh, you already said that.

    You said, “Their doctrine against Christ was adversial and in contrast to whom the Jews should have followed – Abraham.”

    But the fact that the doctrine of the religious leaders was adversarial was never a secret. Search the Scriptures: God sent His “servants the prophets, daily rising up early and sending them”.

    Yet, in the parable of Matt 13, Jesus uttered “things which have been kept SECRET from the foundation of the world.” (Mat 13:35).

    So, I suggest that your answer may be incomplete. Not entirely wrong… we would expect an adversarial doctrine with either interpretation.

    “We may take the seed of the serpent not as Jews or whatever Murray has told you that it is and serpents or those that follow the adversary.”

    I may? Who said so?

  14. The “seeds” are children. Read the scripture!

    The parables were not for everyone to understand. When in private the disciples asked for him to interpret the parables. He did.

    Poly you have a wit for twisting the words. Rightly divide the word. There are many hidden codes in The Word. Good luck on your mission.

  15. John 8:43 Why do ye not understand my speech? [even] because ye cannot hear my word.

    Why don’t they understand him? Keep reading.

    John 8:44 Ye are of [your] father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.

    Do you know who was the murderer from the beginning? Cain. The Devil’s son.

    They may call themselves Jews but, they do not come from the tribe of Judah. They are the “seed” from the Devil. Cain’s children.

    Throughout the chapter in Matt 13 Jesus is speaking in parables. The disciples ask for the meanings and why some don’t have ears to hear and eyes to see. Jesus tells them it wasn’t for everyone.

    Matt 13:36 Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field.

    Matt 13:37 He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;

    Matt 13:38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked [one];

    Matt 13:39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.

    Matt 13:40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.

    Matt 13:41 The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;

    One of those things that offend are the preachers that go around lying and not speaking the truths from God. How can you read these words and make your own interpretation? There are “the tares” the Devil’s children in this world. They were born from woman. Eve.

    Hope this helps.

  16. LOL @ “I am not sure I can pray for you.” How holier than thou are you?

    I don’t call Abraham the son of the devil; for the simple fact he was not born from Eve and Satan. Abraham was from genealogy Adam and Eve.

    Go read to see if Cain is even named in Adam’s genealogy line.

    Satan wanted to defile the womb that Christ would come from. You obviously do not believe Our Father is capable of knowing this from the beginning.

    This doctrine is from The Holy Bible. The Word.

    You certainly do not have ears to hear and eyes to see.

    Pastor Murray teaches from The Word. You argue against The Word.

    The Moral of this story…. Leave poor Polycarp to himself. He’ll find out soon enough that the truth was taught from the Shepherd’s Chapel. :)

    I’ll pray for you, goodbye.

  17. ok you want to call names? Let’s fight the good fight! The book you are reading isn’t very good at its translations. Read, with eye and ears if you can.

    Genesis 4:1 Now the man had relations with his wife Eve, and she conceived and gave birth to Cain, and she said, “I have gotten a manchild with the help of the LORD.”

    As Eve continued her labor she bore the another Son. That’s right TWINS!!

    I hope you are ready to be slapped by The Word :)

    Adam was NEVER Cain’s father. The praise came from Eve and the help from the LORD.

    In your ignorance you cannot see that even the LORD loved Cain!!

  18. again…… another verse to help you “SEE”

    Genesis 4:25 Adam knew his wife again. She gave birth to a son, and named him Seth, “for God has appointed me another child instead of Abel, for Cain killed him.”

    Cain killed Adam’s son.

    You are so filled with hate, Polycarp you are not seeing the writing on the wall.

    ….still praying for you. So that anyone in your path doesn’t learn from your twisted and hateful teachings.

  19. Yes, usually, twins do mean from the same mother and father. But the pregnancy Eve was carrying was from two different men. Yes, Satan is just a man.

    In one out of four hundred pregnancies a “bi-paternal twinning” happens. Meaning there is a different father for each twin. Idential twins are the only set of twins that cannot have different fathers. But if the woman has sex with more than one man she can in fact get pregnant with more than one baby….. separate eggs.

    Cain killing Abel didn’t have anything to do with sex. You are so obsessed with the “sexual” part of this story.

    Here you’ve opened another part of the Bible that most preachers do not preach about…. “The Adam” formed on the 8th day. There was not a garden made on the 6th day. There was no farm animals created on the 6th day. There were “no farmer” in the garden created with the rest of Adams on the 6th day.

    Read, Polycrap, Read. Ask for guidance and a fine teacher like Pastor Murray. :)

    Praying for you….

  20. You ask me the question because you know I do have scripture to back me up. :) Only the Devil or one of his little peons would throw out so much anger and hate.

    You’ve got what you’ve learned burnt into your heart. Yup, the Bible is pretty straight forward. You would think you could “get it” but, I’m afraid you’ve got something wrong with sex and the acts in which babies are made.

    You having my IP# and showing my state or even a city nearby my home doesn’t cause the fear in me that you’d hoped it would. You have shown yourself to be many things now with the addition of theif I guess is no big deal to you. :)

    You want more doncha? Here we go with the sex topic you have such a problem with…

    Angels ( Sons of God ) did in fact have sex with woman. They concived and their babies were called Nephilim. It says so in the Bible. Its the reason why the flood of Noah happened. I’ll let you look that up for yourself.

    Speaking about Angels and sex….

    Another story in the Bible tells us that men wanted to have sex with the angels that were visiting lots family. He tried to give his daughters to the men.

    And there came two angels to Sodom. … And they turned in unto him, and entered into his house. … The men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter: And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them. — Genesis 19:1-4

    “know them” means sex.

    Hope this helps you in your quest to find “sex” in the Bible. :)

  21. The Sons of Seth Heresy

    Beginning around 400 A.D., portions of the church began to take an unusual stand against the angelic interpretation of Genesis 6. Rather than teaching what the text clearly says (especially when examined in Hebrew, below), and what had been the Orthodox Jewish and early Christian view for all time previous, the idea was introduced that this passage “really” referred to the lineages of Cain and Seth, the surviving sons of Adam. They said it simply means that the “rebellious” lines of Cain were marrying the “faithful” descendants of Seth. The unfounded presumption of this theory is that ALL of Seth’s descendants were godly, while ALL of Cain’s were rebellious. While a sketchy pattern can be drawn from Genesis, it is really a ridiculous injustice to the concept of free will and of God’s dealing with individuals to dogmaticly hold to this position. It further implies that Sethites were somehow immune to the effects of the Fall itself.

    http://www.alienresistance.org/sons_of_seth.htm

    You really need to update your logic and reasoning. The children from the union the woman and angels had begat the “giant”. It says so in the Bible.

    READ YOUR BIBLE!! LOL :) You’re spreading lies.

    ps. I still don’t agree that Cain is the son of Adam. …Even though this article says so. But it does say all of Cains sons were bad boys. hmmmm makes you think… at least it does me :)

  22. “This doctrine is perverse, and destructive. I do not know why they let you live in Minnesota – I thought that they were somewhat civilized in that part of the country.”

    This from a Pastor. Again you didn’t cause the scare you intended.

  23. So, you know everything about Star Wars and the fictional charactors in the movie. But, why did you not comment on the lies the church has made about the “Sons of Seth”?

    Do I believe in UFO’S? Read the book of Ezekiel and tell me if you believe in The Word.

    You twist everything to your own spectrum. You are certainly not reading The Word from our Father.

    I see where you have cried about personal attacks against you but, that’s your MO…..a “Projectionist”

    I see the other articles you’ve put on your webpage. You don’t have a good outlook and you see the worst. If you really do pray you really should ask for guidance.

    READ.

  24. E.T. God Bless You. As you know God has put the spirit of slumber on certain people so as not to overload their donkey….I can’t believe anybody that can read the Bible for themselves would believe anything Polycarp says.

    E.T. you are doing so well with him but you should stop casting pearls before swine. I will join you in praying for him.

  25. Your opinion relating to Pastor Murray is of no use to me. If you truly are a teacher of God’s word, spend time teaching instead of worrying about Pastor Murray. God takes care of his own.

    Pray for knowledge and understanding and God will bless you if it is His will for your life.

  26. I believe that Ezekiel did a good job describing the vehicle used as a means of transportation. UFO is a man’s term, I believe that God knows exactly what the vehicle is.

  27. I don’t agree that Pastor’s Murray’s teaching of the Bible is garbage as he teaches it chapter by chapter and verse by verse and he instructs students to not just listen to him but to read the Bible for yourself and pray and ask God for his help in gaining wisdom, knowledge and understanding for yourself by reading God’s word. He’s right as I’ve learn to recognize false teachings and therefore can discern what I believe in accordance with God’s word and not in accordance with some human beings lack of knowledge.

  28. Polycarp…Again, ask God to help you in his understanding of His word. You can be entertaining but I am going to go read God’s word. I pray God continues to work with you. The Bible teaches that all can have salvation though repentese and belief in Jesus Christ.

  29. Polycarp, thanks for your prayers. Again, I gain my wisdom, knowledge and understanding through God’s blessings through the reading of his Word not just by listening to what others say about God’s Word. When I have trouble understanding I pray to God to open my eyes and he does that for me. When teachings don’t line up with God’s word it’s easy for me to discern what to believe. When the end comes I’ll have my gospel armor own and ready to let the Holy Spirit use me. I am sad for those who believe that they will be flying off somewhere.

  30. Kandy, do you believe the serpent seed doctrine, in which certain races of men and attributed to intercourse between Eve and the adversary?

  31. Of course you know that the end is just the beginning for those who believe in the true Christ, right?

  32. I have always enjoyed the ‘The End’ that publishers put at the end of Revelation – as if somehow, the beginning of our return to walk with God is the end.

  33. I believe that Eve had sex with Satan and also with her husband Adam which resulted in her giving birth to twins..Cain, Satan’s seed (child) and Able, Adam’s seed (child). Cain murdered his brother Abel which makes Cain the first murderer. God then blessed Adam and Eve with another child, Seth.

    I believe that God created all the races of people and he looked and it was Good. I believe God established the seed (birth) line through which Christ would come through Eve the mother of all living which basically means if you aren’t in Christ by faith and grace you do not have eternal life.

    I believe that the false Christ returns first and a lot of Christians will be deceived because they aren’t being fed the true word of God.

  34. I believe that God’s word is true and I am blessed that I live in a Country where I have the freedom to study his word for myself. I seek God and he blesses me with the wisdom, knowledge and understanding of his word. We all have to rightly divide the word of God which can be done through discerning the time, the subject and the object. God also provides us through his written word with two or more witnesses to assist us in properly dividing his word.

    Christ tells us through the word that many (false teachers) will come in his name. I use basic common sense in my study of God’s word and what you teach just doesn’t make sense to me. You also keep talking about aliens, abductions, UFO’s and ET…

    I don’t believe God’s word is confusing.

  35. Polycarp, my partner is God through my belief and faith in Jesus Christ. You know that serpent is one of the many names God identifies satan with.

    I am not your judge. I use God’s word to discern false teachings and leave the judging to our heavenly Father.

    Father I think you for all your wisdom and knowledge of your word as it is written. I pray for all to come to know you through your word and I ask for your continued blessings in the name of Jesus Christ. Amen.

  36. You keep asking me about UFO’s. Polycarp, I’ll take my own advice and stop casting pearls before swine. God will be the final judge of false teachers whether it be you or Pastor Murray.

  37. Polycarp, in my own words, I accept no man’s statement. I accept God’s word.

    In accordance with God’s word, Angels are God’s children/servants.

    In accordance with God’s word, God took Enoch.

  38. Polycarp, I read the Bible and ask God to assist me in my understanding of his word. I have no problem with the way Pastor Murray teaches God’s word. From all of your postings, I see that you disagree with Pastor Murray’s teachings. From my perspective it is not about you or Pastor Murray but about our Father in Heaven who gives us all free will and He alone will be the final judge.

  39. I have read a lot about this satan/eve issue on here, which I think is a bunch of stupidity mixed with lies from satan himself to draw attention away from the real issue…What does this man say about Jesus? Does he even teach from the New Testament? Are you absolutely sure, would bet your eternity on it, that this AM is right on it? After what I have read from some of you, my opinion is your blindly following someone just because you need to.

    E.T. your phone is ringing. You better phone home.

    Poly, thank you for standing up for what is right. And your right, this man cannot be related to Andrew Murray, he does not have the ability to measure up.

  40. Tammy, read your Bible for yourself and ask God to provide wisdom, knowledge and understanding of his word.

    Don’t depend on any one person to tell you about God. Read his word for yourself…seek him and you will find him. Let God lead you with the Holy Spirit.

  41. One more question, if you do believe that the words eat of a tree as meaning intercourse, which I think is just totally off the wall, then which tree did Eve have intercourse with which was the knowledge of Good and Evil, satan or Adam? Also, since Eve gave Adam the same fruit and he ate of it himself, does that mean Adam had intercourse with satan also, if satan was the tree of knowledge of good and evil? Is anyone else confused here?

    It is true what my pastor has been teaching. People can take something out of context in the scriptures and come up with some really weird stuff and call it truth.

    I know you guys mean well, but this is the weirdest and of no use nonsense I have ever heard of.

  42. Also one more thing, I would seriously question a man whose main focus was intercourse in the scriptures.

  43. Nevermind on answering my final questions. I went on the websites and got my answers. This man is perverted. Anyone crazy enough to blindly follow this guy deserves what they get. I am praying for you all, but somehow I think God will allow you to stay in your deception until you see the need to get out of it.

  44. Kandy, aren’t you depending only upon Arnold for you serpent seed doctrine? You deny who the Kenites really are, what trees really are, and the fact that Adam was the father of Cain and Abel – all against Moses and the Prophets. Only by Murray do you receive this doctrines…only by the neo-nazi Murray do you see them.
    http://www.carm.org/chapel/arnold_murray.htm

  45. Tammy! That are wonderful questions. I have not thought of it that way, I mean when Adam eating the fruit. Great questions.

  46. Could it be that Adam took Eve’s sin upon himself as he was the head of her as Christ took the world’s sin upon himself as the head of the Church?

  47. Wow. what utter nonsense to think someone teaches this distortion of what the Scriptures say concerning Cain, Eve and satan.

    I’m just shocked this person would teach such trash.

  48. 2Peter3:7-18 But the heavens and the earth which are now preserved for fire until the day of judgement and perdiction of ungodly men. But, beloved, do not forget this one thing, that with the Lord one day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. The Lord is not slack concerning His Promise, as some count slackness, but is longsuffering toward us, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance. But, the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up. Therefore, since all these things will be dissolved, what manner of persons ought you to be in holy conduct and godliness, looking for and hastening the coming of the day of God, because of which heavens will be disolved, being on fire, and the elements will melt with fervent heat? Nevertheless we, according to His Promise look for new heavens and a new earth in which rightousness dwells. Therefore, beloved, looking forward to these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, without spot and blameless; and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation–as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given to him, has written to you, as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures. You, therefore, beloved, since you know this beforehand, beware lest you also fall from your own steadfastness, being led away with the error of the wicked; but grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. To Him be the glory both now and forever. Amen.

  49. Peace, I do read the scriptures and I follow the leading of the Holy Spirit as well as the teaching of the office of the Apostles, not the fakes ones such as the NAR, but the Apostles of Jesus Christ. The way I would put it based on what God through His Spirit has revealed to me, God can’t lie and this man is lying. Once again, I would run very fast from someone whose base focus is on the instances he views as intercourse in the Bible. God will not be mocked.

    Besides, I am developing a very good ability to discern and I discern this man is a false teacher and should be avoided at all cost. One warning I intend to heed.

    Thank you Poly, I wish that was not a question, but I found his site and that is exactly what he is saying. He is a very sick individual.

  50. Tammy, intercourse has been a part of God’s plan for our salvation from the beginning; man turned into something dirty not God. God bless you always.

  51. Tammy, I should add…man turned into something dirty…which was Satan’s plan.

  52. PeaceBlessin,

    What was your purpose in posting 2Peter3:7-18? I would have used that scripture to show what Murray has done concerning Cain, Eve, and Satan – at the very least.

    Man is sinful, but GOD has a perfect lasting enduring all-encompassing plan that includes that sinfulness. He knew what would happen and allowed it to happen that He might be glorified. Satan is included in God’s plan, and in fact can do nothing without God at least allowing it (Job 1:6-12). God’s plan includes people like Murray who twist scripture to say what it does not say, and Peter warned of men like him.

  53. Intercourse? No, God’s plan for my salvation was slain from the foundation of the world. You go ahead and believe whatever perversion you wish, I will stand in the Grace of my Lord Jesus any day.

    You are correct on one thing, intercourse has been made dirty by man just as satan planned. But you know what is filthier? Taking the wonderful sacrifice of my Savior and making it into something so slight as intercourse. What He did for me, the other could never do. I will never lower my Savior and His sacrifice to the level of such an act. You should be extremely careful as you do this. It is not me you will answer to, however, God will judge and you may be extremely disappointed at the outcome.

    You have mentioned my Savior only once in passing in a scripture reference. Did AM die for you and rise again for you or something? I bet not.

    Evidently, you have not met my Mastor, His name is Jesus, Son of God, crucified, died, rose again, defeated death and sits on the right hand of God the Father making intercession for me. Your Mr. Murray could never top that.

    Do you even speak of Jesus outside of a scripture reference? Do you even consider the words you say? Remember every careless word will be remembered and will be judged.

    I have had enough of you and your perversion. I turn you over to God to do with as His Holiness dictates. In turn, He may turn you over to satan who probably is laughing at the sight of you and your deception.

    Don’t offer to pray for me, it would be a curse and God will not allow it. Waste your breath on someone else.

    Poly, where do these people come from? The deception is getting worse.

  54. AMEN! You know like that song,I KNOW MY REDEEMER LIVES! JESUS DOES AND STILL REINS AND WILL FOREVER…PEOPLE JUST COME AWAY FROM THE WORLD,AND EVERY FALSE THING THAT IS IN IT! WORSHIP AND TRUST ONLY JESUS,HE IS THE ONLY WAY!

  55. Tammy, I don’t even know you and have nothing but God’s love for you. We all have the opportunity for salvation through our faith in our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

    Why do you call me names and judge me? I am not your teacher and am only a student in God’s word. I don’t ask you to believe me about anything. I’ve said read your bible and discern what you want from that. If it is different then what I discern not a problem as God will take care of both of us. False teachers have a special judgment coming from the Lord and I will leave all judgment in the Lord’s hands; I am not afraid of God, I love God and he knows my heart and will judge me accordingly.

    Polycarp should be teaching out of love instead of teaching out of hate which then fosters hate among people who come to him for guidance. God is love and he loves all his children and we all are trying to do what is right in the eyes of the Lord, I know I am.
    I have never witnessed such hate among people who are supposed to be bringing people to the Lord. If our salvation was through man we wouldn’t need God but because we know our salvation is through God why spend time hating a man…pray for him and let God do the judging.

    Forgive me if I have said anything to make you hate me. I also pray to the Father for his continued wisdom, knowledge and understanding of his written word for everyone. I pray to the Father freely about whatever and whomever out of love not hate.

    wb, the scripture served its purpose.

    Peace be with you all. Heavening Father I ask your forgivness if I have offended you or any of your children in any way and I thank you for your forgiveness in Jesus Christ name I pray. Amen.

    I will not post to this site any further.

  56. I direct this at the group. I do not find where I called anyone a name or judged them personally, only turned them over to God and called the teaching that they follow perversion as that is what it rightfully is. If Kandy feels that I have judged her, then she read what I wrote in a spirit that is not from God. What I wrote was plain and supported the Lordship of My Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. What name did I call her? I don’t find it. When did I judge her person? I did not. When did I judge what she was putting forth, and I might add alone as all the others tucked tail and ran, plainly as I am allowed by the scriptures as to not fall for the same deception. There was no hate put forth by anyone on here, not even by Kandy. I never put someone not agreeing with what I believe as hating me, but as disagreeing with me. At a certain point if I do not feel they are getting the jest of what I am writing, I stop for then it crosses the line of casting the pearl of great price before swine. Not calling anyone such, but relaying the truth set forth by the scriptures. As far as the issue of me not wanting her to pray for me, that is my right of protection. I do not allow just anyone to speak prophetically over me if they are not reading from the scriptures, I do not allow just anyone to pray for me as they may not have the goodness of God functioning in their lives, especially when they have proven with words that they follow a false doctrine. You would never ask satan to pray for you, would you? I follow the doctrine of the Lord Jesus Christ and His amazing Grace. No other doctrine will ever replace it. Whatever belief anyone has concerning the old testament, I will only try to point out the truth of believing in Jesus over that, but if they refuse it, I leave it alone as they are refusing the truth. Not the truth as I see it, but the truth according to the scriptures, and that my dear friends is my last post to this particular issue.

  57. Tammy,

    I did not think you judgmental. I thought you calls wrong teaching exactly what it is. Some people think that is being judgmental. It is merely being obedient to God.

  58. Check out http://www.esnips.com/SCRevealed to hear great audio recordings of Pastor Murray being taken to the Third Heaven, motioned to by Elijah the Prophet on a cloud…. and hear that infamous recording, Judah is Germany.

    Go to http://www.mediafire.com/?vz1iettok5n and learn where the Chinese really come from. (preview below)

    The Book of Genesis, Chap 1, as taught by Pastor Arnold Murray

    “Gen 1:20 And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature.. Listen carefully.. that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in the open firmament of heaven.

    Now there is a strange thing that happens here.. and I don’t teach this.. necessarily. It’s not something I would want to debate, certainly.. but I feel that I would be lacking if I did not call it to your attention in passing.

    That the word life as it is utilized in this verse if nephesh, which is soul. And the word nephesh it is not always used as man’s soul, but as life 472 times it’s used and is translated as soul. And 282 times it can even refer to life in one various form or another. But here we know that ‘let the waters bring forth abundantly’ he create’s a living being. That’s what a creature is.. and He gives it a soul.

    Many of you with your Companion Bibles.. it will even tell you that the word life is soul. Nephesh. And I have to mention this in passing that naturally.. in my studies in history I know that Chinese history goes back a lot further than our history. Chinese history even reports over Mt Ararat a great flood in the dynasties of their time.. and they are a people that grow their wheat from the water. Called rice. And they basically live from the water.

    So I just mention that..in passing.. that you might not consider this a fish real soon. Like I said, I wouldn’t debate this, because there’s not that much to debate it upon, but yet at the same time.. as a student of history there’s got to be a reason why that their history goes back so much further than ours. History means ‘his story’.. Okay? Their story goes back a lot further than our story goes. So be it. That is yours to put on a self, do with it as you please..”

  59. Who’s Who?

    In the 1960′s – early 70′s a group of friends & associates mostly from California decided to buy land near Clarksville, Arkansas to build a compound where Kingdom Identity believers could bring their families to live. Among the group were Wesley Swift, Roy Gillaspie & Richard G. Butler (Aryan Nations) of the Christian Defense League, Butler’s mother Madge Britton who later formed the Holy Hills of Zion Church in Decatur, Arkansas, Gerald L.K. Smith & associate Opal Tanner White, Fred Demoret – later pastor of Christian Identity Church – which was also pastored at one time by Thom Robb of the K.K.K., and pastors Arnold B. Murray & Lee Jandebeur who would later collaberate to write the Shepherd’s Bible, a Kingdom Identity version of the bible with commentary. The compound never came to be, but the group met in a trailor behind the home of Alonzo (Lon) Mefford. Much of the Kingdom Identity writings of the 1970′s took place in this trailor, which doubled as a library of records for the movement.

    Wesley Swift was founder and minister of the original White Identity: Church of Christ, Christian of California. Gillaspie started another church branch in California. Robb & Murray both started branches of the church in Arkansas, with Murray later changing the name of his to Shepherd’s Chapel. He has retained a corporate identity of Soldiers of the Cross, Inc., Gravette, Arkansas, and was ordained by that corporate founder, Kenneth Goff of Soldiers of the Cross Kingdom Bible Institute, Engelwood Colorado. Graduate of SOTC, Thom Robb (K.K.K.), currently owns the Soldiers of the Cross Bible Campground in Harrison, Arkansas and pastors the Church of Christ Christian, Independent.

  60. Oliver Kenneth Goff’s Soldiers of the Cross, school of Englewood, Colorado was known by two names: The Soldiers of the Cross Bible Institute and Rocky Mountain Kingdom Gospel Bible Institute. Thom Robb, current head of the K.K.K., was among the graduates. There was at least one fire that destroyed much of the school. It was rebuilt at least once.

    Three zip codes recognized as Engelwood, Colorado are actually a number of towns and cities in Arapahoe County including Engelwood proper, Sheridan, Greenwood Village, Cherry Hills Village and parts of unincorporated Douglas County. It is a Home Rule Municipality, as protected under the Constitution of the State of Colorado. As such it is self-governing, which in the past has made it attractive to a certain element among non-profit organizations.

  61. Hmm. I wonder how can we tell the folks who are writing the “My Comments” search page that it is not picking up the threaded comments all the time. Anyone know?

  62. OMG!
    How can you people say Arnold pastor Murray is a faults teacher, he’s the best teacher I and my husband have studied the KJV Bible with. Alot of churches I been to do not read the bible chapter by chapter and verse by verse. Preachers in churches I’ve been to pick a chapter to read and they read about 2 or 3 verses than they switch, I found this really confusing and I have stopped going to church because it’s true they only teach people what they want to and sometimes they don’t even read what’s written in the bible. My opinion about Arnold pastor Murray is that when he reads God’s Words he goes by chapter and verse by verse without skipping and he stops and explains what God is talking about and it’s very easy to understand what he is trying to say because it’s a match up with the stronges accordants KJV. The real faults teachers are the ones in Churches who don’t care about reading the bible to us and just talk about what they want like, Building a new gym for the kids. This has nothing to do with what is written in the bible so why did the preacher bring this up? At first the preacher from one of the churches we went to was reading, “How Satan try to temped Jesus” and then he closed the bible and slipped in, “We need to build a new gym for the kids”. I was like, “huh”? that’s not in the bible. So after that my husband and I got up and left. Ever had Jaohva witness in your home? Ones we had were two elderly women and my husband was just interested in wanting to know where the black people came from, this is not a racist thing, he just wanted to know how did they exist. So Sarah one of the ladies said, “Well humans are like chickens so take a chicken for an example” Now these two ladies didn’t make any sense, because there’s no way chickens are a comparsion to humans and we just cracked up really bad about what they believe.And another thing also when they read their Bibles we never laughed at them but when we read our KJV of our bible they were laughing and being really rude. Never again will we have those people in our house, they just kept coming to our house because they wanted us to attend their church, so we decided to go one time to get rid of them, the preacher there didn’t teach us on god’s word so we left and never went back there. Arnold Pastor Murray is the only person I know that has read the bible in God’s words the way it’s written. My husband and I have been reading and listening with him for 8 yrs. now and we will continue doing our studies with him.
    God’s blessing to everyone!:)

  63. All of you need to get a life. The fact is they are all radicals. My dad Kenneth Goff died so he is no longer teaching. I am hid only son and I do not promote hate I am a true follower of Jesus Christ and study the Word of God daily. Cain is no factor in our salvation it does not say the only way to the father is threw cain able or any other person other than Jesus. When you chose to read and follow any and I mean any other book other than the Bible the 66 book love letter of God. Than you choose to tamper with the truth. Read John 1:1 it tells you Jesus is God proving the trinity. Read the minor prophets. Read the new testament. Question every thing threw this book. If it dont line up it is not truth. Follow the false prophets and belive the lies and you can answer for it on the judgement day. My Dad will answer for what he taught. Grow up learn the Word of God repent and except Jesus Christ as your Lord and savior. Be filled with the Holy Spirit and walk in truth and love. Jesus wasnt a hater he LOVED. Realize that and get a clue.

  64. I am not promoting if you read correctly as to what I said he has to answer for what he did and the rest of us need to love like Jesus The Christ Lord of Lords. not get into the wondering of if Cains curse was to be black. It wasnt it was what ever it was but the fact of the matter is none of the Cain facts matter it all comes down to. Do you know Jesus as your savior? Do you believe he was sinnless died for your sins rose on the third day and assended into heaven and is seated on the right hand of God. If you know this and read the Word of God only and studie what it is and love one another as Christ loved us.
    Agape Love pure divine giving all of your self and live a life holy and pleasing to God all the other, fanatical crud shouldnt matter to your walk. The man ordained by my dad and all the other racial idiots need to grow up. So all of you following his or any other false teachers need to get into the Word the bible the truth and learn. learn of what you speak because God is not a God of hate he is a God of love. Kenneth Goff is dead he died in the early seventys he left behind 3 children that are followers of The Christ. We only know love for every one We dont see color we dont see race. I personaly love Israel I support the nation, and my mother was Indian. I have people of every nationality race and yes color in my family. I belive we need to let the propoganda of my father and all the other radicals die. Stop using his works he is gone his legacy is now his kids and we love we dont hate. I dont spread his doctrine I tell the truth and support the Bible. Read it Read it Read it Read it if I didnt make that clear enough for you Read the BIBLE that is the truth the rest is man spouting off at the mouth their own ideas. If you elevate any man uo on a pedastal and idolize him he has taken the place of the truth.
    He has taken the place of God dont allow satan the father of all lies to rob any of you of the love of Jesus. Make God your all in all and let the Holy Spirit fill you and lead you. Life can be so much more when you kick the hate out and let the love in. Let the peace that passes all understanding gaurd your heart. I am a beliver that knows that he who knew no sin became sin for me. I dont want to pound those nails anymore and I dont want my fathers teaching to pound those nails anymore. So once again for those that didnt get it he taught wrong the Bible is the only truth and the only way to true salvation is threw Christ Jesus, and it has no bias on race creed gender or anything else.

  65. First, a little aside for Polycarp: K. Thomas is Kerney Thomas Jr, another TV minister, rumored to be every bit as corrupt as Peter Popof is said to be. You order the free personal prayer package and the follow-up is when he hits you for a “donation.” Fortunately he’s not the brightest bulb on the tree and occasionally runs a caller’s comments on this. Unfortunately, he knows his audience and how to play to them, and just play them. And his breaking into tongues mid-sentence is as phony as it gets.

    As to his holiness Pope Arnold I of Arkansas (which in itself is a major clue, so I don’t need another one, Ken Goff)…none of what he claims to be his personal history can be verified by what should be easily-accessible records. There are no records of his service at the Chosin Reservoir, or in the Korean Conflict, or the Marines. And his doctorate – from where? Under what provisions?

    The only thing that stands up is his ministerial license, signed by a couple of those redneck racist preachers tied in with the Klan and the Identity. And that crowd also knows their audience (which does not include Kerney Thomas or the huge black majority of his flock). They preach to a “congregation” that already knows what they believe and what they want to hear. Murray et al are essentially just telling them they’re right in their racist philosophy (remember, the Bible was held as justification for slavery for a long time; it’s not a real stretch to think this still goes on today).

    The only TV preacher who I think is on the ball is Joel Osteen. He doesn’t talk down to people, doesn’t make you feel “less than,” does not insist that his interpretation of the Bible is the only way (in fact, even though he advises everybody to get in a good Bible-based church, he doesn’t hammer you with his biblical interpretations at all), and spends more time teaching how to live a good life in Christ – and he doesn’t pitch crap like the green cloth or prosperity or the red blood of Jesus hankie, or heal the sick and infirm, or break into tongues. Granted, he does advertise his (and his wife’s) books, and upcoming tours, but none of that distracts from his message.

    Murray, Thomas, Popoff, and all those other carney pitchmen should listen to him – they might learn something.

  66. Hello….I have been with the chapel since 1993. I do not consider myself part of a cult, nor am I mezmerized by Pastor Murray.
    I have watched alot of TV evangelists holding their hands out and begging for money in one way or another. Most every [sermon] is about planting a seed [money]. You can get blown down, spit on….have some ‘miracle’ water sent to you…or maybe a prayer cloth is more your style. I see the hypocrisy all around and it makes me ill. God is the ultimate judge and he has the final say-so. Say what you will against Pastor Murray…but…what if you are wrong? :)

  67. Saint Patrick’s Day is proof of the Kenites. In the part of the world St Patrick would have chased the snakes out from the land there were never any snakes. The snakes were the child of Cain. The sons of Satan. The sons pretending to be Jews who asked for the death of Jesus.

    Yes there are scripture to back this up. But you must do the work on your own Polycrap. :)

    Happy Hunting!

  68. GB, if you do not want to discuss this, then do not post. I will hold your comment in abeyance until you decide whether or not you want to discuss the rather false prophet of Arnie M.

  69. >> PS… The snakes in the Bible referred to the children of Cain.
    >> Those same children were run from Ireland by Saint Patrick.
    >> Read the verse John 8:44 and study the book!

    That’s your speculation -wouldn’t you say? That’s how you pick to interpret that scripture. There’s no proof outside claims from British Israelitists and unverified myth that St. Pat was in Ireland -or took daughters of Israel there. Myths and legends aren’t the same as proof. Legend says that Zeus rules the earth from Mt. Olympus. Legend says St. Nick’s going to put presents under my tree next December. Legend says the earth rides on a giant turtle’s back. Your legend has about the same amount of documentation to prove it, and much less even than the myth of Zeus. ;))

  70. yes this is your blog Mr. ControlFreak. I don’t trust you.

    Thank you for posting my final words to you :)

    You’re beating this topic to death because you don’t understand the Word of God. Your projections are only hurting yourself.

  71. Et, you realize, of course, that I had left this topic alone along time ago – but it is the Arni M. followers that keep attempt to bring it up. You realize that, don’t you, that add you guys not stopped by to ‘show me’ that I would not have returned to this posting. Frankly, his doctrine sickens me, and any man that so relishes the Christian Identity movement does so as well.

  72. You’re simply not getting the point. All Pastor Murray does is read the Bible line by line verse by verse. Why would reading the Bible make you sick? I have not come back to the topic for you Poly. I am here in support of Shepherd’s Chapel and everyone that wants to know the Truth. Not the lies supported for years like… “The world is only 6,000 years old.” When you find the Truth you will know it. I however am sickened by churches bringing man made traditions in the house of God and telling me that I would never understand the book of Revelations when the very title of the book means to reveal.

    Just remember these words, Poly, “Every knee will bow.” When you see that happen you will know that the deception is over.

  73. Poly…As I previously stated…I was just presenting my view on WHY I believe as I do. If you do not want me to post my view, then I will refrain from doing so. I wish you would be a little more respectful of Pastor Murray….and do not address him as Arnie. Good Day

  74. You tickle me. The hate and discontent you spew about Arnold Murray doesn’t change our minds. Come on, lemme guess…is this all about that fly-away junk? We can READ ya know! All this stuff stuff proves just how lucky we are to have a real pastor and messenger of God’s word. It’s OK though. I understand God also has a sense of humor. What a hoot!

  75. Hey “Polycarp” are you going to admit that you plagiarized your entire article, which was written by Casey Sanchez for the SPLC website, or will I have to provide proof?

  76. Hey Folks, the person who wrote several posts here under the name “SC Revealed” posts at www. factnet. org as “Stage_Director”. Despite what you might think of Murray, she is an obsessed, extremely dishonest individual and you can see her entire at at FactNet.org especially under the thread called Cultblunderers and Shepherd’s Chapel II.

    It was she who fed Casey Sanchez the load of BS that he wrote about, the very article posted above. I’m a Chapel student of twenty years, and if you bother to see the truth, just go to FactNet and read about the dishonesty, rumor mongering, and mis-characterizations of what Murray teaches. I post there as Smyrna.

    As for those who act so shocked at teaching Satan had sex with Eve, do you homework. Ancient Jewish literature claims the same thing, as well as many other ancient religious texts. Murray didn’t make it up, not did Branham.

    Google Jewish Encyclopedia, and look up Cain, Satan, and Kenite and that should start you off.

  77. You mean, prove beyond the link to the original site and the inclusion of ‘Southern Poverty Law Center’ in the tag? Sell your goods else where, George

  78. A link isn’t sufficient, you wrote: “by” “Polycarp” how many people knew that was a link?

    Plus, you don’t bother to post my other info by that sleazy rumor monger “SC_Revealed” I’ve busted her lying so many times, it doesn’t matter whether you wish to “reveal that here.”

    As for the article, we (myself and other students) ripped it apart:

  79. FactNet is a “disgusting and vulgar site?,

    Excuse me sir, but you just damaged any credibility you may have tried to impress me with. Because FactNet.org is an anti-cult site, with hundreds of thousands of posts and thousands of contributors. I offered no other links.

    Amazing that you would characterize that site in such a manner.

    I will however, accept you explanation about the link to the SPLC. But it still strikes me as disingenuous that you aren’t immediately forthcoming by explaining in the text that you are merely copying the article.

  80. Ah, I love it when my posts are deleted, it tells me three things: One, that you read them. Two, that you are fearful of them, three, you don’t know how to respond to them without incriminating yourself, which overlaps the fear factor.

    When I take the above into macro analysis, which of course would have to include your careless revelation of your connections to those miscreants at CBgalactica and CBRefugeecamp, then it becomes a slam dunk:

    you are a misinformed,(via of your published sources) misguided (via your own overinflated ego) and a coward (based upon your actions) who, no matter how you may disagree with SC teachings, has proven beyond a doubt that you are incapable of making any type of unbiased analysis of your own.

    You may think I am some brainwashed cult member, that would be your biggest mistake among many. It is you Sir, who have followed your own pre-conceived notions, which sent you looking for only those things you readily agree with, that is so painfully obvious be the references you have cited in regard to the SC.

    But, everyone has a right to develop sloppy research habits. Good to see you have taken full advantage of that right.

  81. You never really left this topic, Poly :)

    READ THIS SLOWLY….. The Bible is read chapter by chapter, line by line, word by word, to the members of Shepherd’s Chapel………. If you want to KEEP calling our Creator a liar, his Son and the Holy Spirit a liar then be ignorant, Poly.

    Defensivness comes from Satan. Deception comes from Satan. You are against freedom of speech and love the argument you think you obtain from this topic you set up. There isn’t any proof in this blog to suggest you know anything about the plan of God. “Barren fruits”. You are doing the works of the Devil.

    Come out! Jesus loves you :)

  82. Polycarp, I know you read everything that comes thru this blog. You believe that the churches told their flocks the truth. I am telling you they lied. They teach their people to fly away, the Bible says so. ( Ezekiel ) They Bible also states that all the things cannot happen until Satan comes first. ( Thessalonians ) These things are told to us from our Holy Father in Heaven. You wish to continue against Pastor Murray …. just remember this…. The man that sat ontop of his home didn’t receive want was sent because he didn’t have faith. What will it feel like when Jesus says to you.. “I never knew you!” When he shuts the door.

    You have led a few astray. You are leading his people away. He wants ALL to come to Him!

    Read the Bible! Learn the parable of the Fig Tree! Jesus ordered it.

    Farewell, Polycarp :)

  83. [B]Deny the obvious, embrace the absurd[/B]

    If they’d be willing to place them on their car bumpers, I’d pay to print up stickers for the SC detractors saying that.

    As we see with LetUsReason.org who the CB Blogger “Polycarp” considers a

    divine oracle of truth, he simply accepts that whoever wrote that slop about the SC teaching that a literal snake mated with Eve in the Garden.

    Even long time detractors like Stage_ Director/SC Revealed know that is not true. SC teaches that Satan was a fallen archangel, and just as later in the Genesis text in Chapter 6 we read of the Nephilim (i.e “Sons of God”)mating with earth women and that giants were bore from that, it’s no leap to see that is the correct rendering of the events in the allegory of the earlier chapters.

    Until the Dead Sea Scrolls were discovered, fundamentalists and literalists believed and taught various interpretation, none of which included the fallen angels. One version had the sons of Adam/Seth marrying the daughters of Cain, refusing to acknowlegde that the angles were invloved at all.

    This all changed when the DSS were discovered, and we found ancient texts that went into great detail about the fallen angels.

    But few if any believe a real snake was involved in the temptation and fall of mankind in Genesis, those that do still think the fruit is an apple too.

    You can take the kid out of Sunday school, but you can’t take Sunday school out of the kid. That kind of sums up our resident racist detractor Aryan/Truth_child/bold22, those unfamiliar with this character can be read at CBRefugeecamp.yuku.com as well as cultbustersgalactica.yuku.com and you’ll see what I mean. He’s bold22 at both forums, I supose the 22 rfers to his Intelligence Quotient.

  84. Murray nor his family are racist, quite far from it. Polycarp is a liar, & acting like a true spiritual Kenite, for it is HE who is truly in fact a “racist,” as is anyone who falsely accuses anyone of being, despite the facts & countless testimonials by truthful humble individuals whom can attest. Just like the far-leftists do on a daily, make that, almost hourly basis – play the race card to further their warped, anti-God, or anything good, agenda. Yahshua Hamashiach said to fish from the RIGHT side of the “boat,” what do you misguided, deluded, gullible, fall-for-anything-individuals think He was referring to (as well as more than a few other references to the “right” made by Scripture)?! Poly, you sir, are a deceived man, gullible, but it’s alright, because the Bible says to leave your types alone, yet while we still fight against your false doctrine with the Truth. I’ll bet you voted for the current administration, the largest lot of crooks, fools, & cons the world has seen so far next to the Johnson & Carter administrations. & Carter claimed to be a “Baptist minister” of sorts; well, Jesus Himself said many will come as false shepherds, & many will be deceived. Stay where you are Poly, & it will only get hotter. I pray that, even as Paul initially fought against Christ, that if so in the last moments the Lord will help you realize your err, & you wake out of your slumber, unless He deems you unworthy because of your evident present spiritual apostacy. But that is God’s business; but I as a follower am bound to call you & your likes out, as have the rest of these good men & women have here. You, sir, are a fraud, & should be ashamed of yourself for repeating false accusations that God will certainly have you answer for. Get informed b4 it is yet too late for you. I came down hard on you because you incite falsehood & rebellion against the True Word of God, by looking to essays, lies, & accounts from other men who are also ne’er-do-wells, instead of checking unbiasedly yourselves, causing strife, derision, & division. May Father have pity & mercy on you, for only He truly knows why you are doing such foolish things, & it is He who is the True final Judge. I am just simply a lowly “discerner.” In His Name…

  85. Another post deleted, George. Why? Because all you want to do is to defend yourself and provide no Scripture to support your doctrine.

  86. So, Poly, I see what you are up to. You want everyone else to do the work while you sit back and call us liars rascists or whatever new name you’ve come up with.

    Alright then.

    Ezekiel 13:18-20 “the souls that ye hunt to make them fly”

    Ezekiel 13:
    18 And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Woe to the women that sew pillows to all armholes, and make kerchiefs upon the head of every stature to hunt souls! Will ye hunt the souls of my people, and will ye save the souls alive that come unto you?
    19 And will ye pollute me among my people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, to slay the souls that should not die, and to save the souls alive that should not live, by your lying to my people that hear your lies?
    20 Wherefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against your pillows, wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly.

    Rapture, the Big lie.

    While stating “farewell” when parting could mean a permanent departure; stating a farewell message is an “acknowledgment or expression of goodwill at parting”.

    ¡adiós! :)

  87. I am appalled at this behavior of false accusations against Brothers & Sisters in the Word. & just what do birds do, charlatan-PC? (Funny your acronym can also denote “politically correct”…God has a sense of ironic-humor too!)…Why…they “FLY AWAY OH LAWD” don’t they…hmmm. Wrong again, PC. What pray tell, is the passage about then, oh all-wise-&-knowing man of god (since you don’t give any specifics to back your “ideology/imaginations of men” up as you should by God if you’re going to debate Truth properly!)? First of all, you quote the NEW KJV; any responsible, studious Child of the Living God is quoting the original KJV, period. Throw away all these inferior translations of the Holy Book with their subtle incorrectly translated words in strategic places, (for they are like the dividing of Christianity into all the ridiculous subdivisions/denominataions we have today) in ignorance or not, it does not change the facts. Christians are Christians. There’s only ONE Scripture, 1 God, & 1 Word AKA the “Holy Trinity,” & 1 True Christ. Secondly, it has everything to do with “Arnie’s Theology,” which is your “down-the-nose” term for the actual literal WORD OF GOD. You obviously either A) know NOTHING about “Arnie” & are repeating the compounding lies you’ve been hearing long enough to believe in them, which is a secondary or later source, & of which the Word condemns “gossip” as evil, or; B) you are deliberate, making you perilously close to a spiritual kenite. Either way, it’s not very impressive nor good credentials for spreading rumors & lies as a gossip-monger. You are reprobate & debased in every way in any of your defenses, not to mention you “deny” what is told you with vague statements than offer NO studious, knowledgeable solution or rebuttal, a sign of a true hot air balloon. & either way, you are deceived. It is Highly possible God has allowed the “strong delusion” sent for “those who choose to believe lie(s)” you to chew on. Your present God is NOT our God. If you were a true Christian, you would never falsely accuse a brother in the Lord as you & your likes have done. The 1 good thing of your negativity that the Lord will turn for Good is, you actually help True Brethren here, because any responsible, sound-minded person searching for the Truth will be driven to look into each of our points, & those who will & are deserving will be driven into the discovery of Word of Truth. The rest, we don’t need to worry about, those who are mislead will be mislead. Pray for them, there is yet time. So, in essence, you actually help the cause! After that, I kick the dust off my feet from before you. You have been warned, so that now, when the things that befall you that are poised to do so in the near future, due to your own choosing, which you will receive full recompence for unless you repent, you will know that the Hand of God is upon you to chastise you. You are presently part of the negative side to God’s Plan, but look Up, for you may repent & learn the Truth at any time you choose while you’re still here, so there;s yet the chance of hope for you yet. My intention is not to be rude to you, but whay you have done by way of false ccusing a Bother deserves stern rebuttal, but you & yours cannot or will not listen (“spirit of slumber/stupor”). -In (albeit tough) Love…

  88. It was not my intention to cast dispersion on the NKJV, as the passgae quoted still contains the essential message – what are do birds known to do? But the orig. KJV quoted earlier contains the accurate thought that the NKJV WAS TRANSLATED DIRECTLY FROM. In other words, oh wise sage of the word, your NKJV version is lifted directly from the OLD KJV. Sorry to slam-dunk your poor reasoning & reading skills again.

  89. Ez 13 : 17 – 23 (KJV)-

    17Likewise, thou son of man, set thy face against the daughters of thy people, which prophesy out of their own heart; and prophesy thou against them,

    18And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Woe to the women that sew pillows to all armholes, and make kerchiefs upon the head of every stature to hunt souls! Will ye hunt the souls of my people, and will ye save the souls alive that come unto you?

    19And will ye pollute me among my people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, to slay the souls that should not die, and to save the souls alive that should not live, by your lying to my people that hear your lies?

    20Wherefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against your pillows, wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly.

    21Your kerchiefs also will I tear, and deliver my people out of your hand, and they shall be no more in your hand to be hunted; and ye shall know that I am the LORD.

    22Because with lies ye have made the heart of the righteous sad, whom I have not made sad; and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not return from his wicked way, by promising him life:

    23Therefore ye shall see no more vanity, nor divine divinations: for I will deliver my people out of your hand: and ye shall know that I am the LORD.

  90. Interesting developments lately. Holocaust Museum shooter has ties to Willis Carto………. Ken Goff was neck deep in Liberty Lobby.

  91. “You mean, prove beyond the link to the original site and the inclusion of ‘Southern Poverty Law Center’ in the tag”

    I thought you where the author that wrote this article too. You do not state it in your article this review was taken from another site and was not written by you. You should do your own research then write an article yourself. Least then you can come to your own conclusions and your debate would seem more credible. We should be lifting each other up in Christ not tearing another down. God Bless.

    • Scot, it’s pretty clear who wrote this article. The first line in the article references the SPLC.

      Further, Arnold Murray is not in Christ. As I have done my research, I can fully attest to that fact.

  92. I respect what you believe polycarp it seems that if the article was just about doctrine then I would pass it off. The commenter then goes into detail how pastor Murray Pulled out a 9mm? What does this have to do with bible doctrine but to only enforce a hatred towards Pastor Murray. I would like to point out the audience was laughing towards the end of the video. Does that tell you anything?

    Now which is it.. do you want to bash Pastor Murray personally or bash his doctrine? Because when you do both it becomes more than an argument about doctrine, it becomes a hate filled article aimed towards a man. God Bless.

    • Sorry, Scot, but you cannot separate man from his doctrine, especially the doctrine which the man Arnie M. preaches. It is a hateful doctrine. I am not bashing, but speaking the truth.

      Tell me, if Hilter was funny, who cares? And yes, of course his audiance would laugh – but was the person to whom the gun was pointed at laughing?

  93. I have been studying with Pastor Murray/Shepherds Chapel for over 20-some odd years, always looking to the Word for myself and studying. There are so many lies being told about him it makes me sad. To mister polycarp- you have got to be the worst example of a Christian I have seen in a while. What happened to brotherly love among fellow Christians? The name calling and such… really now. Grow up man!

  94. Christ and christ crucified is what he teaches.Give him a break and go bother the Muslims

  95. Ummm, I sure do love the WORD OF GOD— and i sure do love Pastor Murray for being BOLD in CHRIST to sure “feed the sheep” with the word of GOD. THANK GOD for HIM. (I'll pray for you too who wrote this trying to throw him under the bus….lol DON'T YOU KNOW GOD is driving his bus??…lol) ……Tell the truth and shame satan. -amen!!!

  96. A man is known by his fruit. Your fruit is rotten Polycarp. You have proved yourself ignorant and unwilling to get to the truth. There is however good reproof on this conduct of yours. Let me give you one of the many:

    Proverbs 10:18 He that hideth hatred [with] lying lips, and he that uttereth a slander, [is] a fool.

    Quite honestly Polycarp, you are bearing false witness against a good honest man. Your hatred consumes you and you have chosen a fool's path instead of righteousness. But do not take my word for it, open your Bible and read for yourself. It IS written, and you cannot change the word of God. A lot of Christians stay ignorant in the word because they don't read it. They take a few verses here and there to fit their idea of how things are and off the go. Don't you think its time you actually know what you are talking about? Have you ever met Pastor Murray or his children? I have. They are wonderful people. His late wife was also, and all of them are quite gracious. You, on the other hand, come across as a thorn in the side of Christianity… your probably someone people avoid or just agree with you until your through prating.

    While I may not like your conduct here with the false accusations, I do like the idea of your life changing for the better. Study the word.

  97. So… you readily attack me for ‘attacking’ Murray, but provide no scriptural evidence for his lies and corrupt doctrine….

  98. I would like to know if murray is familiar with the writings of Helena Blavatsky and Manly Palmer Hall. I am kind of thinking that he might be a scholar.

  99. Would you people just listen to yourselves on this thread. This is full blown religious psychosis. It is sheer INSANITY!

  100. Arnold Murray is long given praise for taking on the “tough” subjects, but why are they tough? Why do other preachers not take them on? It is because the Bible is not clear on such subjects, we just don’t know…and neither does Arnold Murray, but yet in his puffed up vain mind, he dogmatically declares it to be true. Satan is here to “Fly us away” how does he know this? Is it in the Bible anywhere? You are a cult in you believe in the rapture? The bible is full of raptures! Compare Enoch, Elijah, God delivering Lot before the destruction of Sodom. This man does not know what he is talking about and it really pains me that he preys on the gullable and those that don’t really know their bibles. The mark of the beast is doing the works of Satan? Since he likes to quote greek so much and claims to be a greek scholar, the greek word for “mark” in Revelation is Charagma, and it means a literal stamp upon ones self. Tell him that during one of his answer sessions

    • “tough stands” doesn’t a prophet make. Murray is teaching a false gospel and is in fact leading a cult. You have all the evidence here.

  101. Hi polycarp.

    I enjoyed your exchange concerning Pastor Arnold Murray’s stuff. I’ve studied Pastor Murray since the early 90s. I referenced Pastor Murray often to make my points. I linked your exchange concerning Murray to one of my pages “The Original Sin”.

    I have “The God Murders” website:

    http://www.thegodmurders.com/

    I selected controversial Bible C&Vs and commented on them. This website has existed since 1995 and is a work in progress. I’ll share 2 perspectives:

    The God of the Bible is not a good God and the Bible is not a good model for humanity.

    Challenge: Other than the myth of creation, can you list, by Bible C&V, whereby the Old Testament God did something Good for someone without hurting another?

    How long and of what meaningful quality is your list?

    Regards, Gary DeVaney

    • Gary, while I generally don’t mind engaging in such things periodically, I simply don’t have the time to waste. I happen to believe differently than you and because I read the entire OT with an eye to how it was originally read, I believe that most of the ‘bad parts’ are generally misread.

  102. You are twisting a few things just as you are claiming he did! Firstly he didnt say that God flooded the earth because of the mixing of races! He said God flooded the earth because of the mixing of the blood lines with the angels of Gen. Chap. 6 who left their first habitation and saw woman of the earth and they were beautiful! They took wifes and giants were born! He flooded the earth for that reason not blacks, whites or asians! Also you implied murray said cain was the first jew! This shows your ignorance because Jew comes from one of the sons of Isrial who wasnt born till long after the event in the garden! Also he never claimed the Jews were the seed of lucifer, his point was clear, the blood line that was afected by the incident in the garden causing cain and the incident in gen chap 6 causing the nephelium survived the flood because noha was told to take all life on the ark including those mixes of highbreads! Two of every flesh! So through generation after generation the blood line intermingled with all the races, white,black,asian and all religions including the jewish people and christians and muslims, but because the prophecy involves the tribe of jews and the 12 tribes of Isrial than that mixed seed will involve themselves into the Jewish people and cause chaos and cause the good jewish people to look guilty, just as they do in the christian community or muslim or black or white or asian! There has been years of mixing by marriage so know one knows who the decedents of cain are or the decendents of the nephelium are, they look like! Some of them are guided by a dark force to attempt to sway their supposed equals away from the overall plan of God! And since the over all plan of God involves the jewish people and the other tribes of Isrial it stands to reason they would intermingle with those races moreso! This is why it is writtin those who claim to be jews but are of the decedents of Satin (Lucifer) the way you leaned one way and left out full subjects and sentences tells me you may be of that (negitive bloodline)

  103. You are taking things out of context the same way most churches do to the bible! Do you know who is a master of the bible? Who knows it inside and out? And who would be a great teacher if he didnt have a different agenda? Satan! He knows it so well he can twist the words around, he can leave key words out while explaining his point, he can put half truths,he can add words and thoughts! Hey you know what I just realized, Satan actually does the same thing with the bible that you did with this article! Wow amazing how easily that was to figure out! You just have to follow the subject matter! Im sure you will get a few more RH negative followers and RH positive followers to believe your twisted words of deception!

  104. O dear…. you poor thing! You know having all those initials behind your name has made it very difficult for you to understand the alphabet and subject matters! Line upon line! “Precept upon precept “! It kind of reminds me of the biblical character who was a pretty decent guy that helped people and was well known in the community for helping but was very very wealthy kind of like you are wealthy with knowledge! He came up to Jesus and preceded to brag about how much he does for people! And Jesus said to follow him and to sell all of his possessions and give away all of his money and walk on this path with him! This man was so upset when he heard the truth! I mean he waspo helpful, he did try but to give up that power and all those initials he built up after his name and all the power he has gained because of that! It grieved this man terribly! Oh dear….Poor thing! By the way are you RH positive or RH negitive! Only 9 to 15 % are negative! But dont worry if you are negitive it was commanded to us not to do anything to those with this mark! It is amazing how technology has allowed us at this time in history to see the mark left in the DNA and blood line of a person caused by Genesis Chapter 6! I said to my self years ago before Murray; if this were true there would surly be a marker in the blood and the DNA so i started my research on blood types and DNA and once again the manuscripts proved to be true to their word once again! But people such as your self with a lot of initials behind their name proved arrogant enough to move away from common sense and say o the blood must have had a mutation 35000 years ago, even though blood rarely to never does! So to make it fit in their version of life and initials this one time we will say it mutated! The only man made equivalent (intelligent equivalent ) to reproducing this type of blood change was when humans crossed a horse with mule to get a man made donkey! But what do I know? I dont have all those initials, i only have the bible a library and common sense! It’s easy to count and keep things in order if you have common sense and not initials! Poor thing!

    • I, um, do not have initials behind my name.

      There is just so much wrong in your comments that would take too long to respond.

      • Hi Joel. Can you produce a list whereby the Biblical God did something good without hurting another? Let’s see the quality and quantity of your list.

        I’ll prime the pump. God allowed some old women to have children. But, Who made them barren in the first place?

        God gave Solomon wisdom. What did Solomon do with God’s gift of wisdom? Solomon had 700 wives and 300 concubines. Solomon ended up serving other gods. Personally, I think the wisdom took. Regards, Gary DeVaney “The God Murders”.

        • Oh, you’re one of those… who think that they can use my blog to sell their own book…

          Well, consider yourself banned.

  105. My i gave my interpretations along with the chapter/ my key point is the blood line and where it came from and i explained where YOU misrepresented Arnold Murray and where you left out full thoughts! For example if you make a statement ” O that man is a nice caring man” but leave out in your statement he also is a child molester! Wouldn’t you think it would be important to tell the whole truth so a person isnt stuck having only your opinion! Your speaking about individual as if they are a cult but you are the one shorting their quotes or misrepresenting their interpretation basically saying they are wrong and you are right! How do you think aperson who watches someone and knows there interpretation because they have been studying with them feels when you misrepresented what that person stands for? I in a colorful way was showing you that someone else is known for that too! It is they Devil! I was trying to make you see you are telling half truths about murray to sell your own interpretation / that is wrong and evil if you knowingly do that! I study with him and i know half of what you wrote was an outright deception! And how i reacted is natural when someone falsely misrepresents a brother! You have a right to your thoughts and interpretation as does Murray, I gaurentee Murray would finish why you feel the way you do if he were making accusations against you! And although i used some science fiction in trying to slam my point home to you, I also know i am telling the truth that if you use half truths like i know you use against Murray and his followers than nothing you say can be trusted! It goes back to common sense whether or not you have initials after your name! A teacher who clearly sways people against another teacher with half truths will surly teach half truths also!

  106. Wow i hope all of us grade school students who misspell a word or two because they are blogging and writing with emotion quickly can one day reach your standard of ethical practices! When we achieve your status i guess thats when it is okay to misrepresent somone with half truths! That lack of education with my penmanship and spelling i apologize for. Hopefully one day from your point of view we can be like you and the other great deceiver! Lol o boy joel! When you have no true arguments check the spelling! Hahahhahaha lmao

  107. And by the way the response i wrote before this and the last one some how skipped what i wrote in certain areas! I have know idea why this took place maybe my type writer became possessed!

  108. Whats real sad is instead of answering my questions you attacked my pragmatics and eschewobfuscation. Which is an expression to explain how one confuses the issue instead of answering the question and rebutting your clearly false accusations! I didn’t think i would have to speak this clearly to someone who should understand people on all levels with your supposed background! Lmao!

    • Let me help – For the most part, I have no desire to sift through a huge block of words to find a sane question.

      So, if you want, you can pose one question at a time….

  109. My God man! As Dr. Mccoy would say to Captain Kirk! What do you think I had to do with what you wrote!

  110. if anyone dont like shepherds chapel all i can tell them is dont watch it , he teaches bible and that makes satan mad so if anyone is mad , guess you got the wrong spirit

  111. this is so sad that you people are so educated probaly from a semiar that teach you how to think you no more now anything about the bible i study with pastor arnold murray and the the father and his son that they teach the truth and not what you want to hear and i can tell you are a false prohet spreading the lies like satan’s children do but the time will come when you will meet the father in heaven and then explain to him about your lies so sad for one person to spread lies because he can’t handle the truth of GODS word

      • BEFORE YOU SPEAK AND YOU SPREAD YOUR LIES TO EVERYONE STUDY YOUR BIBLE AND MAYBE YOU CAN LEARN THE TRUTH ABOUT GODS LETTER TO US AND THEN MAYBE YOU CAN STUDY WITH THE REAL PEOPLE WHO WANTS TO LEARN GODS LETTER TO US THANK FOR PASTOR MURRAY AND HIS SON DENNIS LEASE THEY LOVE GOD ENOUGH TO SPREAD THE WORD INSTEAD OF CLAIMING THEY KNOW GODS WORDS AND NOT TRY TO SPREAD SATAN’S LIES IN WHICH YOU ARE DOING SUCH A GOOD JOB OF SPREADING THE LIES I PRAY YOU LEARN THE TRUTH NOW IF NOT MAYBE YOU WILL HAVE YOUR EYES WILL BE OPEN SOON MAYBE YOU OUGHT TO TRY LISTENING TO PASTOR MURRAY YOU MIGHT LEARN SOMETHING AND THEN MAYBE YOU CAN SPREAD THE TRUTH ONEDAY

        • That is a rather long sentence and given that so many words were used, you were unable to make a coherent thought.

          • YOU ARE SUCH A POOR LITTLE FOOL I KNOW THAT FOR SURE BECAUSE LOOK WERE YOU STUDY AT AND A FOOL WHO CAN’T ANSWER OUR OWN QUESTIONS BUT SO LITTLE WORDS

          • Good thing you said that in all caps or I might night have heard the full thrust of your argument. Whew…

  112. I listen to this program and sometimes I do not agree with what is opinionated, but most of all I hear the Word of God spoken when they read from Scripture. Not too many others do this. Ask for discernment and God will give it to you. Then instead of bashing search out the Scriptures for yourself and search out what God is speaking too you. Says in Scripture do not believe Man but the Word of God.

    • Emily,

      Arnold Murray doesn’t know Scripture. Just because you read Scripture aloud does not mean you know what you are talking about.

  113. Was an interesting read I got several laugh and giggles. We all know that Murray is persecuted because he’s not a sheep herder like mainstream religion. He does not sugar coat or beat around the bush so to say. As a young child I discovered the lies of many churches by reading the Bible for myself. I mean the first chapter of Genesis (if you read it and go to church) you will realize they leave a lot out. Immediately, they start twisting things to fit their version of the word of God. I mean are people so adapt to believe anyone they will not read and learn for themselves? Any smart person will know that you do not listen to every word that comes out of someone’s mouth. Everything is open to your own interpretation. I don’t care who you are that book was written to each and everyone of us. Not one person is better at telling you what that book says than you reading and doing the research yourself. It also helps to have an open mind and look around to all religions and maybe it will click the similarities from the Hopi Indians to Christianity. Bet very few know the connection there. Pastor Murray in my opinion is a highly educated man who most of (though I don’t agree with everything) the time is right on the money. I would love to sit down and have a discussion with him any day. To try to put him down or call him out makes you look a fool and as judgmental as it gets. I mean isn’t your job as a Christian type not to judge or are you a hypocrite like most. Just saying when you claim to live by a certain standard then live by it. Have a nice day.

  114. Apparently most people think we are all a bunch of inbreeds LOL. Isn’t that as bad as saying we came from monkeys?

  115. There is some debate over the Serpent Seed doctrine taught by Arnold/Dennis Murray. Why not evaluate and discuss? Why all the name calling? The accusations in the article posted here are unfounded and complete hype. I’ve looked very closely at the SC’s teaching for over 5 years. Yes, the Serpent Seed is unconventional. Big deal. You should learn to be respectful of other views and learn from Dennis, who is an accomplished OT Scholar, even if you don’t like Arnold. SC has been a blessing to me. Calling them ‘racist’ is a cop out. That term is a worn out canard. Grow up.

  116. Tree of Life= Jesus who became the Christ- It’s Fruit=LOVE, God is love
    We are to bring forth much fruit- some 30-some 60- some 100 fold.( Mark 4:8)
    Tree of good and Evil. Isaiah 14:12, tells us what happened to Lucifer. Dr. Murray teaches that Lucifer earned his position as protector of the Mercy Seat. Because of pride he was cast down to the earth. In the garden, he then became Satan. He underwent a name change. Lucifer knew about good but because of the sin of pride, He became our adversary. Question= was he happy or bitter? Heb. 12:15 tells of us the ROOT of bitterness springing up in you. Lucifer / Satan were in Eden (Ez. 28:13)

  117. Welcome to The Shepard’s Chapel bubble study hour with Pastor Ar-nut Murray. Wisdom is understanding Dog’s word. Pastor Murray’s unique teaching approach brings Dog’s word alive with meaning, as he takes you on a chapter by chapter, verse by verse study, of Dog’s letter to you, the Bubble.

    And now, here’s Pastor Ar-nut Murray!

    Gooooooooooooooooooood day to you all! Dog bless you! Say welcome to the Shepard’s Chapel, this family bubble study hour. Ready to get back into our father’s word, er, em, mmm, I mean our Ol’ Yeller’s word!

  118. David Murray died in 2013 of a heart attack. None of the three are false teachers as posted in 2008. I guess some people will hold out to the end when it is to late before they will hear the TRUE WORD OF GOD that Pastor Arnold and Dennis teach.

  119. How about The First Epistle of John Chapter 3 verse 12 “Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, … Who was the wicked one, was it Eve or maybe it was Adam or could it be Satan?

  120. you people cant handle that he teaches the bible verse by verse instead of standing up in front of the pew teaching a couple verses then talking about the sunday ball game. I’m a hard core workin texan, carry a .44 with CHL. I took wife to Gravite so she could get babtised. I dont study bible and get into it like she does but when i shook Mr Murrays hand at the end of sunday service my eyes watered. I believe in the lord but dont study. A shit kickin Texan that was awed by the feeling of the lords power in his hands. I guess if you dont like my post thats you’re problem.

    • I agree with jimmy. How many people get much out of 2 verses and the preacher talking 4 20 minutes about nothing. By the way preachers r taught is seminary not to talk over 20 minutes because the average persons attention span is that long. Well, Christians sould have a longer attention span than the average JOE. I do, I watch Arnold Murray or Dennis 8 hrs a day and never lose attention . Folks better wake up and start learning BIBLE preferably from Pastors Muray.
      Brian Thompson

  121. Just curious and would like to see if some confusion could be cleared here. This goes out to all the Shepherd’s Chapel supporters.

    Who exactly is your teacher?
    What scripture(s) support the serpent seed and 3 earth ages?
    If not totally from scripture(s), then what basis is the prior two pulled from?
    Do you believe you should still follow Moses’ law, i.e. not eat pork, be circumcised, and etc?
    What exactly is a Kenite and how exactly do you know if someone is one, or not?

    I don’t need anything lengthy. Just something short and to the point in what your understanding is and where you got it from.

    • We will give very brief answers:
      Jesus Christ should be everyone’s teacher. (Men can help only)
      Read Jer.4:approx v 18 on. This is not Noah’s flood. It is referring to the world that was.(1st earth age) 2nd Pet. 3:6, We are living in the 2nd (evil) earth age,2nd Peter 3:7. We are looking forward to the age to come.
      Promised seed became the word (Jesus) John1:1… seed by biblical definition are words. Satan uses words (seed) also. This is how he impregnates one’s mind.2nd Cor.11:3.He twists the truth. Clean food which God has ordained (1Tim. 4:5) Circumcision is now of the heart, (Ro. 2:29) etc..
      A Kenite becomes a son of Cain when he refuses to take Godly advice or teaching from God.(Gen. 4:6-7).God’s precious promised Seed is Jesus the word of God. A Kenite is not always reckoned by genealogy.(Gal. 3:28)

  122. I’ll never come back to this toxic post; but hopefully I can help at least one person by writing. It’s sad how literal you people are taking Murry. I’m expressing the same frustration you can hear in his voice during Q&A at the end of his show.. People, we aren’t talking about Spongebob or a game of dodgeball with team A and team B. Try to go beyond the 3rd dimensional flesh, linear time, and black or white ideology. Give yourself some freaking credit as a human being! Our consciousness and mental capacity is nothing that can be simplified to black/white Jew/gentile… If you’re stuck on those concepts you need to seriously pray for some divine knowledge to come your way. If God read your opinions I would assume he’s either terribly frightened at how elementary adults think; or he would just chuckle and say “that’s free will for ya.” Please do yourself a favor and pray to God and seek Truth!!!!! Also buy a water filter because clearly the flouride is effecting most of your IQs. Take Care.

  123. Joel,I used the term “toxic post” before reading your bio and after only reading a few responses, admitingly. I regret that and apologize if I came off nutty or negative. My insomnia gets the best of me sometimes lol. Not a “follower” of Murry, I saw him on tv and decided to google him out of curiosity, which led me to this blog. Anyway, your books seem really interesting. I’ll be sure to check them out. (This was not appropriate for the twittersphere IMO lol) Have a good day.

  124. I have made this precious brother a part of my morning life. Where he sits reading from his King James, requesting that everyone buy a Strong’s Concordance to know the exact meaning of the Greek and Hebrew words, and also reading the Strong’s Concordance actual meaning of any word which might possibly be questioned, and then telling everyone at the end of each daily reading that THEY need to be in the Bible themselves. Every day, not listening to any other human on earth, just themselves getting the answers from Father God through Christ the Annointed of the Father.

    Then I see minions and deceivers and tares here ripping this man apart? For saying that there are demonic creatures masquerading both as jews and Christians, and that’s some kind of ‘heresy” teaching? When and if you all get to Heaven, as I hope I will, you will see Arnold Murray in the inner circles of Christ’s closest friends. For those ill informed or simply evil ones here ripping this man apart, probably you will not see it, period.
    May the promise of Deuteronomy 28, first or second half as deserved, fall now upon all commenting on this most precious brother and friend of God. May the blessings promised of first or second half now fall upon
    all posting here. As deserved. Selah, and Amen. I would caution all against bad mouthing this particular brother. Be not deceived, Little whatevers, God is not mocked. Nor are his close friends. It’s just not wise to do.

  125. Well, I see the old fraud (Arnold Murray) is now dead. When I worked nights I’d tune in this clown just to have a belly full of laughs. I can understand that some good old boys with little to no education would become devotees of Arnold Murray, but for a person of reasonable intelligence to believe in Arnold Murray is a complete mystery! Arnold Murray liked to use Dr. in his title. He was challenged by many skeptics and even some theologians to present his academic achievements. Murray never once lived up to the challenge but only to call skeptics and other challengers heretics, heathens and idiots. Evidentially Murray didn’t have a doctorate; he never attended any college for that matter. Murray made himself out to be some sort of war hero as a sergeant in the marines during the Korean War. A sergeant he was but certainly no war hero. He “educates” himself with the bible and then becomes a self proclaimed biblical teacher. Murray’s dim perception of the bible is a self tailor format. It’s the magical, mystical world of which the man lived. A virtual recluse all of his life the man married and raised two very odd looking sons. The poor boys were raised to believe the utter nonsense dictated by a tyrannical bible thumping father. Murray decides to go global preaching his nonsense and starts up his own television network. Just like any tele evangelist they start out low, build up a following of limited thinking devotees and start asking for their money. Murray made his fortune off of his ignorant followers’ tithings. The man had a fleet of private jets, acres of property, expensive automobiles, a luxury boat, etc. In other words Arnold Murray was a monetary villain. He was a fraud! I can only hope that his only surviving son, Dennis, decides to shut down The Shepard’s Chapel for good. This world doesn’t need anymore brainwashed cretins following prey to these tele preachers. If Arnold Murray really truly believed in a god and an afterlife well, then, I’m sure he was in for a big surprise when he died and saw the “bright lights and heard the angels singing to him while he wooshed down a tunnel,” only to have everything go black. An oxygen deprived dying brain and a wild rush of ketamine made the old man have his last hurrah before everything went black permanently. There is scientific proof that the afterlife DOES NOT exist! NO GOD! NO DEVIL, NO ANGELS, NOTHING! ABSOLUTELY NOTHING! Eminent Professor Sir Dr. Stephen Hawking presented new evidence proving these facts! And according to John Lennon’s tune Imagine, yes people imagine……

    • Why would someone who doesn’t believe in the afterlife, angels,heaven or the Bible even care what Arnold Murray has to say or teach? Oh, I better check my spelling and grammar. We have to focus on that instead of the real issue because we can’t come up with any other form of attack!

  126. Joel your an Idiot anyone who would listen to you just you yourself

  127. Get a life ,and stop worrying about what others teach ,and worry about what ,you teach ,I have been with the SC for 20 years and never heard a racist thing come from there , and in the flood he destroyed those who mixed with Nephilim . you need to get into the word and stop your nonsense.

  128. Watts, why do you think Adam and Eve covered their private parts with fig leaves? BECAUSE THEY ATE FRUIT WITH THEIR GENITALS? Watts, I BELIEVE that you have never come to realize that LEARNING IS THE PROGRESSIVE DISCOVERY OF YOUR OWN IGNORANCE. I hope this help you. May God touch and heal your crippled intellect.

  129. Hey Rainbow Fish, or PolyCarp, just as I asked Watts, I now ask you: Why do you think Adam and Eve covered their private parts with fig leaves? BECAUSE THEY ATE FRUIT WITH THEIR GENITALS? You need to slow down and realize that LEARNING IS THE PROGRESSIVE DISCOVERY OF YOUR OWN IGNORANCE. You have made so many comments which are baseless in fact, or in direct conflict with known scientific facts they are too numerous to respond to. Just one example: You stated that “twins had to be from the same Father” WRONG. JUST GO READ THE FACTS IN ANY MEDICALLY BASED WEBSITE CONCERNING CHILD BIRTH. JUST ONE OF THE COUNTLESS ERRORS YOU HAVE MADE WHICH JUST LIKE THIS EXAMPLE, ALL STEM FROM PERSONAL IGNORANCE. YOU ARE NOT WELL READ ON ANYTHING YOU ARE COMMENTING ON AND YOUR WOULD BE SO EMBARRASSED IF ONE DAY YOU STARTED TO LEARN THE FACTS. I hope this help you. May God touch and heal your crippled intellect. Just keep in mind that LEARNING IS THE PROGRESSIVE DISCOVERY OF YOU OWN IGNORANCE. FYI- EVEN THE OLDEST STORIES FROM THE MYTHOLOGICAL gODS AS WELL AS OTHER RELIGIONS CONTAIN THE same STORY OF THE “gOD OF CREATION” GOING AGAINST THE WILL of the “GOD OF THE WORD” BY TEACHING HIS CREATION how TO HAVE SEX WITH WHOMEVER THEY CHOOSE. AGAIN THIS WAS APPOSED TO THE WILL OF “THE GOD OF THE WORD” WHO WANTED TO CONTROL ALL THE BREEDING AS WE WERE SUPPOSEDLY CREATED TO BE WORKERS FOR THE gODS AND THUS THEY WANTED TO SELECTIVELY CONTROL THE REPRODUCTION TO REPRODUCE ONLY THE SPECIMENS BEST SUITED TO DO THE WORK. Just like most religions have the story of the flood, SO ARNOLD MURRAY IS NOT THE FIRST TO TEACH THIS. EVEN THE MOST WELL READ ORTHODOX JEWISH RABBIS BELIEVE THAT EVE WAS BEGUILED OR SEDUCED BY SATAN AND THEN EVE (ALONG WITH SATAN) WENT TO ADAM AND SHOWED HIM HOW, WHITCH RESULTED IN NON IDENTICAL TWINS. THEY TEACH THAT SATAN MADE SURE HE CONCEIVED WITH EVE FIRST SO HIS SON CAIN WOULD INHERIT THE GARDEN/FIRST BORN SON BIRTHRIGHTS. WAKE UP MAN. Selah.

  130. OK polycarp and Joel L. Watts, step back and take a simplistic look at the Adam and Eve story. The setting being a beautiful Garden with a beautifully perfect male and female specimen WHO WERE NUDE, and who, in the aftermath of having partook in the “forbidden fruit” and obtained the “knowledge of the good and evil,” DO YOU GUYS REALLY BELIEVE THAT NO SEX WAS INVOLVED? When God saw they had been disobedient, WHAT was Adam and Eve doing at that moment? THEY WERE COVERING THEIR GENTILES WITH FIG LEAVES!! THEN LOW AND BEHOLD two sons were conceived then born. You guys are pitifully naive and will never learn even the most very obvious, UNLESS YOU REALIZE THAT IT IS OK TO DISCOVER YOU ARE SIMPLY IGNORANT. That is what learning is all about. .

  131. AB, that could be a good deal of your problem – reading comprehension – I said that I have found Murray wanting, not the bible. I am not ‘slamming’ Murray but telling the simple truth.

    The tree of which Eve ate was not the tree of life, as that was expressly mentioned
    Then the LORD God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of Us, to know good and evil. And now, lest he put out his hand and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live forever”– (Genesis 3:22 NKJV)

    Adam and Eve did not eat of Christ – as there was not an Incarnation yet – but were disobedient to God. To guard against the Tree of Life, God sent them away from Eden. Your interpretation is false, as is your understanding. The problem with declaring that the bible is filled with figurative language is that the man of the hour can dictate what it means. Read Origen for some of the things that he wrote because he understood the language of the bible to always mean something else.

    The ‘fruits’ by which we know someone is not the fruit of the tree of life, but what is produced by the life that is led. You really should study for yourself, AB, and be ready for what you find out about your salvation.

  132. We disagree in that Murrary teaches that Eve had intercourse with Satan, which is an unbiblical doctrine. You attempted to say that fruit was a figurative term in the Scriptures. I understand that. I deflected because if you begin to take things figuratively, the there is no end to you false doctrine, of which Murray is a prime example.

    Humanity was punished by a separation from God after the Fall. No is saying that the snake was magical or that the tree was, but I will say that Even did not have intercourse with Satan and the Hebrew Old Testament covered it up with the image of the tree of good and evil.

    AB, Murray has lied to concerning the serpent seed doctrine.

  133. AB, you have been so blinded by Murrary that nothing will get through to you – well, many one Day it will.

    The Seed is Christ. That is plain by the Messianic prophesy concerning the heel and the head. We may take the seed of the serpent not as Jews or whatever Murrary has told you that it is and serpents or those that follow the adversary. You are indeed very wrong when you say that Christ was speaking to the Church and calling their father the devil. Indeed, it was the Jewish leaders, and He was being figurative, not so literal – which is odd since you allegorize nearly everything else. Their doctrine against Christ was adversial and in contrast to whom the Jews should have followed – Abraham. Do you really believe that Eve had sexual license with Satan?

    Please, all offense taken with this – but that is stupid and heretical.

    In the parable of the seeds – the seed is doctrine, not seminal fluid. Parables were not supposed to be literal, but figures of what Christ is trying to tell those with hears to ear. The problem with only reading one passage in one Gospel and not seeing where it lines up with the others is that you can come away with a pretty rotten doctrine, such as the serpent seed fiasco of Murry, Branham, and that crackpot from the Pacific Rim.

    In the parable of the Sower, “the seed is the word of God” (Luke 8:11). But here that word has been received into the heart, and has converted him that received it into a new creature, a “child of the kingdom,” according to that saying of James (James 1:18), “Of His own will begat He us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of first-fruits of His creatures.” It is worthy of notice that this vast field of the world is here said to be Christ’s own – “His field,” says the parable. (See Psalms 2:8).

    This is why Paul told Timothy to rightly divide the word of God. The proof is in the bible, not Murray’s mind.

    I could care less if Murray is a Trinitarian. Really. Read my blog. He is a racist, condemning non-whites to these Kenites, or is it the Jews? Who cares about self-defense. That is not a doctrine either. And BAB, read the blog under the category of False Prophets and you we will not the many times that I point out the likes of Joel Osteen and Creflo ‘Can you Spare A’ Dollar.

    I thought not.

    Yes, that is indeed your problem – lack of thinking.

  134. BAB, no insults to you – just that doctrine that you teach. There are no such thing as Kenites, as they have been assimilated – and they were not the descendants of Cain.
    From CARM:

    The Kenites, according to Mr. Murray, must be exposed. “We must continue to teach who the Kenites are,” says Mr. Murray, (Newsletter #190, August 1994). He states that the Kenites survived the flood (he denies the global flood) and are found in the lineage of Israel, not Judah, (Newsletter #179, Sept. 1993). Eventually, the Kenites permeated the nation of Israel and are the ones who shouted “Crucify Him,” in reference to Jesus, (Newsletter #179, Sept. 1993).

    In an attempt at biblical support, on his website at Answers to Critics, Mr. Murray states:

    In Gen. 3:15 God is speaking to the serpent, “and I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shall bruise his heel.”

    Mr. Murray infers that when God says “thy seed” to Satan, He is referring to the Kenites, the descendents of Cain which were literally produced through the literal “seed” of Satan.

    Yes, please move on. I tolerate racism and sexism about as much as I do false doctrine – and Murray promotes all three.

  135. Coffee,

    Why did you post your question here? Next time, please try my discussion page. I do not know of K. Thomas but I doubt that we have the same opinion of speaking in tongues.

  136. E.T. – indeed your ideas are,

    Yes, I have heard and read, and spoken with members of the cult – long before I knew what heresy was. Arnold Murray has shown himself false too often to count.

    http://www.letusreason.org/Poptea4.htm

    Why would I hold a political leader accountable to the word of God when they do not suppose to heed it? Or was that a jibe at the ‘Kenite’?

  137. First, parables are not secret hidden agendas – they are small stories which tell a central moral truth. Further, we have to rightly divide the word and allow scripture to interpret scripture. The ‘seeds ‘ are not code words for sexual intercourse with satan and the results.

  138. E.T., show me were ‘seeds’ are children produced by intercourse between Eve and Satan? That’s stupid. Further, there is no secret biblical code system. Finally, if these ‘things’ were told in ‘secret’, then how does Arnie know them?

  139. You are an ignorant racist. First, hyperbole is a common speech pattern in ancient Palestine as well as today. To say that someone is a son of the devil is to imply that they are bound in sin. Eve did not have intercourse with satan, she disobeyed God. Or did she then have intercourse with God to have Seth? Do you even realize the paradox that you would place yourself into? Further, if you contrast this verse with 8.37, you would have to call Abraham a son of the devil as well. This is an ignorant and racist thought.

    The murder was the ‘murder’ of Adam and Eve, when they ‘died’ from the presence of God.

    We are all born of Eve.

    This doctrine is filfth, garbage, sewer. It stands squarely against God and His Christ. I am not sure I can pray for you.

  140. E.T. You are an ignorant racist, and so is Arnie Murrary. First, in 37, Christ acknowledged that the Pharisees where children of Abraham. See, you actually have to read these things. Thus, if in verse 44, these same children of Abraham were now literal children of the devil, that makes Abraham a child of satan, you illiterate racist.

    Cain is not named in the line of Christ because that line was destroyed in the Flood, when only Noah, the son of Seth, lived. Pretty simply there, unless you say that Noah was a child of the devil,which now makes Christ a child of the devil. You realize that your ignorance has turned into blasphemy. Your doctrine is from your father, the devil.

    You would have us racists. Tell me, do you still lynch at S.Chapel? Still throw pennies at the Jews, or what do you call them, the Kenites? Seriously, how warped are you?

  141. Further,

    Now Adam knew Eve his wife, and she conceived and bore Cain, and said, “I have acquired a man from the LORD.” (Genesis 4:1 NKJV)

    Thus, the idiotic and heretical doctrine that Eve mated with the devil to produce Cain is proved wrong. Adam was Cain’s father, and the praise of the birth was given to the LORD.

  142. You realize, of course, you biblically illiterate racist, that Adam is Hebrew for Man, right? Further, by context, the man in 4.1 is the same man thrown from the garden after he had come to know right and wrong, Adam. The book actually happens to be the bible. Twins? You realize that Twins would then have to have the same parents, right?

    Adam and Eve conceived she brought forth both children – Cain was no different than Abel, you heretic.

  143. E.T., your prayer to your father the devil does not for me. So what? Cain killed Abel – only an illiterate racist would say that this has anything to do with intercourse between the devil and Eve. You and Arnie have a sick and perverted mind, filled with illicit sexual union.

  144. Ignorant Racist, you realize that you have no scriptures to back up anything you say, right? Not even logic. Just because Pope Arnie says something in no way makes it true. The adversary was more than a man, epitome of biblically illiteracy, as he was a fallen angel. Can to tell me how angels and human can mate when there will be no such thing in heaven? Are you sure you are not worshiping Zeus?

    You realize, that the bible is pretty straight forward here – Adam, (Hebrew for Man) actually fathered the child. Only the penthouse flavoured mind of Bishop Arnie, patron saint of the Klan would read of a perverted act of intercourse here.

    Oh ye who are intellectually behind and epoch, Adam was not created on the 8th day – the two creation accounts are a form of Hebrew parallelism.

    Prophet Arnie, miracle of the twelve level of hell, can only teach those that consider lynching a fine past time.

    This doctrine is perverse, and destructive. I do not know why they let you live in Minnesota – I thought that they were somewhat civilized in that part of the country.

  145. You realize, you porn-o-phile, that the men in Sodom didn’t know that they were angels, right? They thought them men. So, you who sees the bible as a penthouse letter, your assumption is wrong. Further, no one is trying to scare you, oh ye who cannot read past Monsignor Arnie’s Biblical Thought for Dummies – I was commenting that I find it odd that someone in Minnesota could be that badly educated.

    No anger towards the doctrine of the Church, or hatred to things of God, just to the mind set of racism and the use of the bible, however erroneously, to promote lynching. I commented on your and Cardinal Arnie, patriarch of the Bunny Ranch, very perverse appetites and reading them into the bible. Sons of God where the sons of Seth. You would know this, if you had actually read the bible instead of Arnie the Dirty Old Racist Biblical Commentary on Perverse Doctrines.

  146. Not a Pastor, I.R, and again, or ye of paranoia land, this was not fear – but a comment on the fact that I had assumed Minnesota a bit more civilized than those that use lynching as a past time.

  147. Wait…you actually believe that UFO abductions are happening? And thus you believe in UFO’s? Really? And you think this makes you credible how? Is Arnie from Venus? Or Vulcan perhaps? Oh, this is rich…

    Actually, according to Genesis 6.4, the ‘giants’ existed before the sons of God and the daughters of men intermarried. But then again, you believe in Klingons.

    You think? Ha! It’s like saying a fish can live on land forever.

    But, then again, you worship Yoda.

  148. Actually, your use of that shows your stupidity. Second, what evidence was presented that the early Church did not believe in the ‘sons of Seth’? Further, what evidence do you have that the Early Church believed in the false doctrine of the serpent seed?

    Actually, the book of Ezekiel speaks about angels, in a very prophetic tone, much like Revelation. Your belief in UFO’s, however, make me doubt the sanity of your mind? Are you typing this from a mental hospital?

    Actually, I could care less about personal attacks – which is a lie you make. Umm…expecting the truth from you I do not.

    E.T. (I get it now), I seriously doubt you have read past your idol’s article. But really, I bet you spend all your time reading Sci-fi.

    The only prayer that I can offer is for you to seek help, and once you have it, please accept it. I realize that you may no longer post here, and that is fine, but remember, on these pages, you will see the truth of the true Gospel of Jesus Christ, one unhindered by the likes of Arnold Murray. If you follow Murray, you will end up in hell. You need help, mental, spiritual, emotional.

  149. Actually, Kandy Cain, you can see that I back up everything I say with the bible – when I am talking about doctrine. Arnie teaches ‘secret things’ which he has pulled our of thin air. Tell me, do you believe in UFO’s as well?

  150. Kandy, you never did answer the question, which I assume you find just as laughable as I do. Yes, E.T. believes that angels are aliens, and that Enoch was abducted, which I assume Murray as taught as well. Actually, part of the ministry is to insure the true Church against false prophets and doctrines, both of which gives me the ability to go after Murray when needed. If one does not put a line in the sand and say that this or that is wrong, then people are free to believe anything, such as the serpent seed doctrine of Murray.

    God has established a ministry

    for the equipping of the saints for the work of ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ, till we all come to the unity of the faith and of the knowledge of the Son of God, to a perfect man, to the measure of the stature of the fullness of Christ; that we should no longer be children, tossed to and fro and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the trickery of men, in the cunning craftiness of deceitful plotting, but, speaking the truth in love, may grow up in all things into Him who is the head–Christ– from whom the whole body, joined and knit together by what every joint supplies, according to the effective working by which every part does its share, causes growth of the body for the edifying of itself in love. (Ephesians 4:12-16 NKJV)

    To allow Murray to teach his garbage without a reasoned response and warning would be to allow this false doctrine entry into the Church. We must not do that.

  151. Kandy, you realize that by your own standards, an entire mass of preachers, all preaching different things, from the beginning of Christianity, are all right. If you have learned anything from him, forget it. Remember, there are plenty that can fool, plenty that can mislead, and all can look so much like the original, that the very elect may be deceived – if possible. Further, remember, a man who teaches false doctrine will teach you out of his own secrets, and instruct you to blind your eyes against the truth. I would suggest that you have a good prayer meeting, by yourself, or join us for one. I will pray with you. I will pray with you until one of our eyes are opened.

    You have said the truth – all can come to repentance, even those that have promoted false doctrines, such as Arnold Murray. Kandy, you will not have a second chance to repent from this false doctrine when the End comes. Repent now.

    Remember, finally, that there have been a mass of preachers from the beginning of the Age that have preached line my line – libraries are filled with such commentaries – and many of those will tell you you need to pray to God to protect you against those false doctrines, as opposed to their own ‘true’ doctrine. A man’s claims of his own self does not measure the man in righteousness.

    Seek the Spirit in this matter, Kandy.

  152. Kandy, if you believe this, then you will join a whole host of people against Christ.

    First, we find that Adam ‘knew’ Eve and she conceived:

    Now Adam knew Eve his wife, and she conceived and bore Cain, and said, “I have acquired a man from the LORD.”

    The JW’s translate their bible based on their doctrine, will you do the same or will you let your doctrine be translated by the Bible? It plainly says that Adam is the father of Cain. Kandy, if anyone has told you otherwise, they have lied to you, and are leading you to hell.

    Remember, if you misconstrue that the ‘tree’ and the ‘fruit’ were intercourse, then you would have to accept that God had allowed Adam and Eve to engage in intercourse with every other tree and fruit in the Garden.

    And the woman said to the serpent, “We may eat the fruit of the trees of the garden; but of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God has said, “You shall not eat it, nor shall you touch it, lest you die.”‘
    (Genesis 3:2-3 NKJV)

    If you believe anything but the bible, including Arnold Murray, then you are against Christ, and if you stand against Him, then He will say to you depart from Him. The only evidence that you have on this is Arnold’s false teaching, which neither of you, or any of the other defenders of the evil one have been able to support from Scripture – only what Murray has taught.

    Further, we know from Jude that those angels that had left heaven in sin were cast into chains. Tell me, how could this one angel have escaped? Is God a liar? Are the words of Moses really code words for alien abductions? Seriously, Kandy, you need to really pray about this.

  153. Kandy, do you realize that your partner in this, E.T., supports the notion of UFO’s an alien abductions of Enoch along with his serpent seed theology.

    No matter what regime we live under, we will always have the freedom to study God’s word, if we want to. Granted, we pay the physical consequences, but God still demands certain things of us.

    You mention the two or three witnesses. Tell me, Kandy, besides metaphors, what notion is there, except in the Kabbalah, that Eve mated with a serpent? Remember, we have to rightly divide the word of God, which means we allow scripture to interpret scripture.

    What part of what I teach doesn’t make sense? That Christ is God? That there is no serpent seed theology? That we may all come to the grace of God? That the bible is just what it says it is?

  154. Yes, the Serpent is identified with Satan, but how do you get ‘eat of the tree’ to mean intercourse?

    Kandy, I do not believe that you fully understand the theology, and the manner in which you arrive at that theology. That is easily seen when you confuse the discussion of UFO’s has having originated with me instead of your fellow Arnoldite, E.T. The biggest part about reading the bible is not to read it as a mystery code book and some preacher as the decoder ring.

    Remember, if you are the only group that believes your doctrine, and has for all of history, than you are leading a false doctrine.

  155. Kandy, in other words, you accept E.T.’s statement on angels being Aliens and having abducted Enoch? Again, you have not answered the question.

  156. I agree with you, Kandy. 2 questions:

    1.) Where does that put you with E.T. (the previous commenter on this post) who claims serpent seed, and alien abduction, and alludes that Arnold M. does the same?
    2.) If you believe as.n you interpret ‘eat of a tree’ as ‘intercourse’.n you interpret ‘eat of a tree’ as ‘intercourse’.

  157. Hardly. Read what the bible says. First, it says that Adam and Eve to eat the fruit of any tree except that one tree. Kandy, upon the false doctrine of serpent seed, we would then say that God allowed promiscuity. Further, if you read, not only did Adam eat of the same fruit (which he admitted in Gen. 3.12) – which would have made him a homosexual – but he blamed God for it. Finally, follow Murray, explain Gen. 3.22 when God feared that Adam and Eve would eat of the tree of life – does this mean intercourse with the Son of God?

    Do you see how perverse this serpent seed doctrine is?

    Kandy, you are adament about God – and you seem sincere, but what are you sincere about? Remember, if you apply the metaphor to one thing in the story, then that metaphor must be applied to all instances of that in the story. Was Adam a homosexual? Did God fear that the humans would attempt to rape the Son of God?

    Kandy, seek God’s wisdom.

  158. Wb, it disgusts me to no end, and makes me angry. I just don’t know what else to say. I hope that your family is well, this evening WB.

  159. Kandy, you realize that it is your doctrine which is judged, right? And that doctrine brings up as must ire as false doctrines did for Paul? It is not hate for a person, but for the doctrines of that person – and that is acceptable. What you call hate is love for your soul, Kandy. No one hates you, nor do they dislike you, but we all stand worried for not just your soul, but those around you, and all of those that believe such garbage as that which comes out of the mouth of Arnold Murray.

    Do you hate me because I tell you the truth?

    Exactly what purpose did that scripture serve? Kandy, you have not once shown any scriptural evidence for anything that you believe? And yet, we are supposed to believe you?

    Kandy, out of love, don’t pass this chance by to interact with those that would love your soul.

  160. Tammy, the thing is, is that everyone who reads this exchange can see what we have tried to do – in real love – for Kandy. You did great, and I am proud to host your comments.

  161. So, you got confused with preachings actually seeking the two or three witnesses required in the Bible?

    Arnie is a false teacher. His serpent seed teaching is a racist slur upon the face of Christianity. You mention false teachers based on building gyms. I take it that doctrine means nothing to you?

    Tell me, where do white people come from?

    False Teacher, I hope you take the time to continue to study with us. If you give it time and prayer, God will open your eyes.

  162. hesatrueteacher,

    I understand the desire to sit under preaching that walks through the Bible. This is a commendable desire, and it is one criteria I use when I have need of finding a church in which to minister. However, another criteria is that what is taught is accurate, particularly from the pulpit. If the preacher preaches/teaches error, then I have no desire to attend that church. I would recommend a similar strategy for you.

    If Murray were teaching truth, then he would not preach that Eve and satan had sex with the result being Cain. Since he teaches that, then he is teaching error and is a false teacher.

  163. Kenneth, I was not speaking to you about promotion. That was someone else, and those comments were deleted. Sorry about that.

  164. GB, I am not wrong about Murray. I have proven that with everything else that I have written. And no, I am for none of the other stuff either.

  165. Poly you say that as if you are sure.

    Remember “God” will not be mocked. His plan is simple and his letter to us is the Word.

    Also there are many people that don’t even believe in Jesus or that Jesus was just a man. If you read the story of the death of Jesus you will read that those behind the murder of innocent Jesus was the church. If you want to believe what these churches have been saying about rapture and flying away then… sobeit.

    You holding someone’s post because they do not want to argue with you in absurb. At least I got to read GB’s comment in my email.

    And every assumption you have about Pastor Murray is wrong :) Murray has a gift of bringing the Bible alive.

    Why does Pastor Murray reading the Bible word for word and line by line upset you so much?

    PS… The snakes in the Bible referred to the children of Cain. Those same children were run from Ireland by Saint Patrick. Read the verse John 8:44 and study the book!

    You’re not going to fly away. When you know this you will remember.

    Every Knee Will Bow! AMEN!! :)

    Thank “God” for Pastor Murray!!!

  166. ET,

    The Church was not behind the murder of Christ. The only ones mocking God are the likes of Arni M. You and your silly attempts to place me in line with others shows your lack of education, or perhaps, rather, your educational source. I will hold any comment that I feel like holding – this is my blog, and if someone wishes to issue ‘final statements’ to which no one can respond, then they need to get their own blog.

    Murray teaches an evil, racist doctrine, which would destroy good people of every color. He reads what he desires, and states what makes him feel good, leading all into that fiery ditch.

    How silly are you that you take legend and confuse it with theology.

    I would suggest you throw away Murray and pick up the Bible. You are lost without it.

  167. ET, you obviously have little to no understanding of the word of God, which is not surprising, given that you believe the satan seed heresy. Those behind the death of Christ were not the church.

  168. That sure is a different set of words than you previously used. Murray does not read the bible ‘verse by verse’ as the Satan Seed racism is not here there. He interprets according to his ‘truth.’ No one is here stating a ’6,000′ year old earth or supporting man-made traditions, unlike the Christian Identity soldier Arni M. who in fact has carried that vile doctrine of men onward. And who cares concerning your view of Revelation (no ‘s’). You hare puffed up in your on conceits. You are arguing that which we are not even discussing.

    Every knee shall bow – to Jesus Christ, not to Arni. M and his heretical serpent seed doctrine. This is a most vile doctrine, created in the depths of hell, to bring hatred and ugliness upon the world. I can laugh at other doctrines of others, but this doctrine, this doctrine alone boils my blood because of the hatred and fear, and racism, which preceded it and which follows it.

    ET, I would suggest that you actually read the bible – first, throw away anything of Murray’s that you have, and seek the wisdom of God. I have no doubt in my mind that you can find the Truth on those pages. And we stand here to help.

  169. The Bible says to give honor where honor is due – Arnie deserves no honor for the deception that he spews forth.

  170. Jami, how can anyone who believes something like the idea that Satan had sex with Eve and gave birth to Cain claim to be able to read? It goes against what the text itself states.

  171. Well, George, anyone with a bit of common sense would see that that was a link. I cannot hold everyone’s hands, now can I? The ‘by Polycarp’ is part of the background script of the page. Again, common sense is needed in this world of ours.

    What other stuff did you provide? You mean the stuff what went to spam? Well, George, I went ahead and saved it for you, not that it will do you any good, as the garbage that you seem to spew is the same that has been dealt with before, not just on this post, but others that I have done about ole Arnie M. Murrary is a racist, and his theology is of the worse kind.

    Because I have a stated policy about allowing links to disgusting and vulgar sites, I am removing several of yours.

  172. No, George, I did not attack FactCheck, just the stuff that people put on there defending Arnie. You can complain what you want, but honestly, of the thousands of people that have seen this article, I think that you are one of the first who actually couldn’t tell that I had clearly linked to the original post.

  173. How could you claim you know anything about what is on FactNET.org, if you don’t even know the correct name of the site?

    And so what do you do instead? Highlight the trivial, the issue with the link to Sanchez’s article, while ignoring more than 30,000 posts written about the SC on FactNET.org.

    Charges of racism, anti-semtism, and so many of the antics and deceitful tactics of SC critics are found all over those boards.

    You are dishonest, is that what the Bible teaches you? You claimed you deleted “links” of mine, because they led to “vile and disgusting sites” when I merely mentioned FactNet.org, which is published by a man who spent years fighting Scientology. That’s your idea of a “vile and disgusting site”? And what went to spam? I don’t see anything missing here, and I’m surprised you even posted what I have sent, save the link to FactNet.org

    Those kind of tactics are what is truly vulgar and disgusting.

    I knew right then you not only didn’t know what you were talking about, but to accuse me of posting “links” to “vulgar and disgusting sites” in an effort to overly dramatize and demonize my comments, is typical of the dishonesty I’ve come to know all to well in SC detractors. Calling FactNet “Fact Check” affirms you don’t have a clue about the site. I linked to one site, that is hardly “vulgar and disgusting.” What’s your real name, Glenn Talley?

    Say what you will about Murray and the SC, but it’s your brand of Christianity that needs to be suppressed. Murray doesn’t teach people to be dishonest.

    Thousands of people read your blog? I doubt it, but it isn’t worth making an issue of. Bill O’Reilly you’re not.

    Something else you don’t know about: that shady, left wing SPLC. It’s obvious you have no clue about that organization, for if you did, the last source for info about anything would be that “vulgar and disgusting” organization.

    Here’s a couple more “vulgar and disgusting” links for you:

    Learn how uninformed people like you support an anti-Christian agenda by your vulgar and disgusting link to the SPLC:

    I doubt very seriously, like your feigned knowledge of FactNET,and complete ignorance of the SPLC, you have ever watched the SC programming yourself, and rely on biased, irresponsible so-called journalism of people like Casey Sanchez, and rumor mongers like Lori Avery, aka “SC Revealed”, who took advantage of the attitude and agenda of the SPLC by writing them with her dishonest vitriol re the Shepherd’s Chapel.

    After learning what the Morris Dees and the SPLC is all about, I certainly understand how they were more than happy to write a smear piece on Murray and the SC. If those behind the SPLC aren’t wolves in sheep’s clothing, there aren’t any.

  174. Well, Ken, I guess I must have struck a nerve. I never said anything about Fact-whatever, just the garbage that is on there about ole uncle Arnie. Since I have stated that several times, I feel that you should have caught on. Your trivial words about this subject only show the futility of discussing it with you.

    Murrary’s brand of hate is disgusting, teaching abhorrent doctrines for the Gospel. It is a shame that anyone would take even a minute to defend him and his garbage.

    Is it difficult for you to read what I have written? I never said that thousands of people read my blog, although it is ranked 364,904 in the world, and averages about 4500 a day. What I said was concerning the number that have visited this particular post.

    I do know of the SPLC, and I was involved in groups targeted by the SPLC. As a member of a political movement a nearly a decade ago, which the SPLC targeted as a hate group, I have no special love for Morris Dees, but the truth is still the truth – which many more, including LetUsReason, speak.

  175. No, Ken, I just didn’t feel like having vulgarity post on the site which is supposed to be devoted to the Lord. I didn’t read them, really, just scanned through the usual garbage.

  176. Uh huh, that’s why my other posts stand. They aren’t any more or less “vulgar” (your escapist term) that the accepted posts. You just have been overcome by your fear. No, matter, neither you nor any of the other CBers have been unable to bring down the SC, if anything, your opposition actually helps the SC.

    Because those who really take a look at the SC, and not depend on websites like you do, know there is much more to what is taught than the overly simplistic, vague and even very dishonest depictions of what the SC actually teaches.

    More than twenty years the SC has been on TV, and if even 10% of what you clowns accuse the SC of were true, at least one major media outlet would have been all over the SC.

    But even the mainstream media, that has no real morals when it comes to their journalism, won”t touch it, and they love beating up on ministries.

    Signed,

    David Ken Mitchell Murray lol!

    2009 January 8
    Dudley permalink

    I believe that Arnold Murray’s other son defends his father’s racist cult on the internet and goes by a cyber moniker as “smyrna” as well as hundreds of other pseudonyms. All in the family.
    Reply

    *
    2009 January 8
    Polycarp permalink

    Dudley, thanks for letting me know that. I which I knew the other monikers.
    Reply

  177. George, I am praying for all of those that is place. It presents a horrible doctrine, a perversion of the glorious gospel of Jesus Christ. And I am praying for you. George, the thing is, is that people know the ins and outs of the SC and those defend it. Just as their is a network to ‘defend’ the undefendable, there is a network which stands to shed light about them.

    No, I know that those of the SC generally do not use the web to research the past of Arnie or the results of his doctrine. Cults generally discourage fact finding.

    Ken, Geroge, David, who ever you are, it is a shame that anyone would preach the horrible stuff that Arnie does, but it is more of a shame to those who would defend it.

  178. No, Et, as anyone can see, the only reason that I return is because someone post a comment. I feel that if someone posts a comment than I has blog owner should acknowledge it, and as someone who knows the truth about Arnie, if said comment is wrong, I will correct the commentator.

    ET, aren’t you the one that said a belief in alien life is compatible with SC teaching? No one is calling God a liar – just Arnie, the false prophet.

    ET, if defensiveness comes from Satan, then you, and George, Ken, and the many others that defend a Arnie must be directly from the bottomless pit. Nice logic you have there. Deception does come from satan – see previous sentence. Freedom of Speech? This is a blog, not a public institution. Learn the difference. If I do not want vulgarity displayed here, I will not allow it. Period. Not even God believes in freedom of speech.

    ET, what Jesus? THe green Jesus that you worship? The racist Jesus of Arnie Murrary?

    What you need to to put down the Star Trek and pick up the bible. There in will you find the true Jesus CHrist.

  179. ET, only cowards make last statements and run. You have a very mistaken belief on my eschatology – which is laughable, because eschatology does not play a role in salvation, to an extent. ET, you are so messed up that you cannot see the fig tree for your space aliens and Arnie’s racism. I implore you, for your own soul’s sake, to have a meaningful discussion – from the bible – and leave behind all the things that you have so far in error learned.

  180. Ken, how much anger you must have deep within you, and how defensive you become over a false prophet. Actually, I do not simply accept anything, but research it. Ken, you stated that I had one source, yet, I have highlighted another, to which you response not to your previous assertion, but now with another one. This is indeed a straw man argument. Your theology and ideas do not hold weight, but instead of defending them, you attack and distract. Again, the perfect example of straw man.

    Your assumption that those that belief in the literal serpent in the Garden must then belief that the fruit was an apple is quite simple a silly notion. While the serpent was real, the type of the fruit was never mentioned. It was, however, not sexual intercourse, otherwise, you would have to interpret the other passages in that same section of Scripture which would have God fearful that Adam and Eve would rape the Tree of Life. Your theology is illogical, and disgusting.

    The sons of God, Seth, did marry the daughters of men, Cain. Pretty simple.

  181. Hey Poly, I’ve not gone! :) I only said farewell meaning goodbye. Not all goodbyes are forever. ;)

    I’m not messed up. I don’t lay in wait for Bible believers.

    As long as you call names there won’t be a civil conversation. Pull the log out from your eye, Man. hehe

    later :)

  182. HAHAHAHAHA

    Well at least one out of three of my posts made it through. And I know you read them because you responded to them!

    Anyways, Poly……

    Where you see anger, I see passion. Where you see defensiveness I see defense. You, Poly, are defensive and the other d that comes from the devil. Not only do you hold, tightly I may add, to the lies told to you. You are a sheep. There are the elect, those people who are persecuted because they speak truth and aren’t afraid of it!!

    Who did Cain marry? Those are the Kinites. What is the fruit of the loins referring to from the Bible? How many times does the Bible refer to a tree as the symbol for a man?

    I’m here, Poly. Don’t publish my posts. But I know and always will know that you speak with a forked tongue and that you do in fact read every single word that comes through this blog.

    Good Day Sir! hehe

  183. ET, you need more help that I can give you. Farewell does indeed mean gone. Applying it at the end of a comment, would lead anyone to believe that you had finally and for good left the conversation. ET, you are no bible believer.

  184. ET, you really need to stop lying about the publishing your posts bit.

    You readily redefine what you need to to defend yourself. Shame that you have to lie even to yourself to defend your men from outer space theology. Et, since you, like George – who disappeared when you arrived – are here only to instigate, until I see something substantive from you, such as biblical verses, then neither you nor Ken/David/George will be allowed to post here.

    ET, I am praying for the people of SC. They truly need the Lord in their lives.

  185. In who’s name? Arnie? The false white god that you have created? I’ll let this go on so long, In Arnie’s Name, because I think it is funny to watch you guys, even in Florida, come out to support Arnie.

    Actually, according to those nasty historical documents, Arnie is a racist and is connected to the Christian Identity movement.

    Of course, because you cannot discuss the issues at hand, you have to pull a straw man and focus on something else. I’ll let you discuss politics all you want, that is not the topic of this post.

    You came down hard on me? Ha! Arnie’s name, that just funny – considering that you attacked Johnson and Carter – Johnson! – instead of defending Arnie, you didn’t come down hard on anything.

    Please, return only if you have the ability to discuss this issue of Arnie’s racism and theology with Scripture. If you do not return in such a manner, I will note that you have no legs to stand on.

  186. ET, since you have attempt to comply, I will let you comment through. The problem is, is that I do not believe in the Rapture, at least not like 99% of the world does. And the other problem is, is that this verse has nothing to do with the Rapture. And, that passage is a pretty bad translation:

    and say, “Thus says the Lord GOD: “Woe to the women who sew magic charms on their sleeves[1] and make veils for the heads of people of every height to hunt souls! Will you hunt the souls of My people, and keep yourselves alive? And will you profane Me among My people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, killing people who should not die, and keeping people alive who should not live, by your lying to My people who listen to lies?” “Therefore thus says the Lord GOD: “Behold, I am against your magic charms by which you hunt souls there like birds. I will tear them from your arms, and let the souls go, the souls you hunt like birds.
    (Ezekiel 13:18-20 NKJV)

    Personally, I agree that the rapture is a lie told to sell books, but that is 1.) not what that passage is about and 2.) it has has nothing to do with Arnie’s theology

  187. IHM,

    First, my ‘acronym’ is not PC, merely Polycarp. So, no, it’s not ironic at all. Some much hate and ugliness in your post, and some many off the wall things. Were to start?

    Um, the KJV was first made in 1611, has had undergone many changes since then. It is a mere translation, like all others, and like all others, is not perfect. To say it is, is to say something not found in Scripture – which you seem to be okay with doing. BTW, the NKJV was not ‘translated from’ the KJV. You realize that the KJV was translated from the Greek and Hebrew, right?

    The passage in question are about fasle prophets who attempt to lead God’s people astray. It as about those same false prophets who hunt the people of God like birds. So, God is comparing His people to birds. Using your logic, that means, that God’s people will fly away.

    ONE Scripture, 1 God, & 1 Word AKA the “Holy Trinity,” & 1 True Christ.

    Now, that’s funny, because God is the Word, Christ is God, and Christ is the Word. Yet, you have God, Christ, and the Word. You separate Christ from the Word. My goodness.

    As a true Christian, Arnie is not my brother. He has to repent, and come by the way of the Cross before he can be one. His doctrine tells us that he has not. The God of Arnie is the same false god of so many before and after him.

    IHM, nothing you have done has been in love, because you truly do not know the Lord. Let us talk about Him, and we’ll see if we can get you there.

    For the future, when you are attempting to debate, try to hold to one point until it is settled. Use paragraphs. Use coherent sentences. And above all, stay on topic.

  188. IHM,

    The KJV says this:

    And say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Woe to the women that sew pillows to all armholes, and make kerchiefs upon the head of every stature to hunt souls! Will ye hunt the souls of my people, and will ye save the souls alive that come unto you? And will ye pollute me among my people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, to slay the souls that should not die, and to save the souls alive that should not live, by your lying to my people that hear your lies? Wherefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against your pillows, wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly.
    (Ezekiel 13:18-20 KJVA)

    While the NKJV says this:

    and say, “Thus says the Lord GOD: “Woe to the women who sew magic charms on their sleeves[1] and make veils for the heads of people of every height to hunt souls! Will you hunt the souls of My people, and keep yourselves alive? And will you profane Me among My people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, killing people who should not die, and keeping people alive who should not live, by your lying to My people who listen to lies?” “Therefore thus says the Lord GOD: “Behold, I am against your magic charms by which you hunt souls there like birds. I will tear them from your arms, and let the souls go, the souls you hunt like birds.
    (Ezekiel 13:18-20 NKJV)

    While both may essentially say the same thing – that the false prophetesses hunt the souls that fly (birds), the NKJV is plainer.

  189. i was watching his sermon and i noticed that he says in the beginning before the sermon starts “BLESS US GOD SATAN ” HE SAYS SATAN SO FAST YOU HAVE REALLY PAY ATTENTION I WATCHED 3 SERMONS BACK TO BACK AND THE 3RD TIME IT WAS CLEAR TO ME WHAT HE SAID .this is so bother some because i thought finally verse by verse but i was deceived for a moment

  190. What you say about pastor murray is not true!!!! You misquote and state falsehoods about what he teaches. I suppose you are one of the many foolish, unlearned and misinformed people who still believe that there were actually two trees in GOD’s garden. Can you really think that our heavenly father would rest the fate of his entire creation on the branches of two trees. Read galations and you will see where we are told again what the “fruits” of these two “trees” are and you will see for yourself that the “trees” produced the same “fruits” from the beginning of HIS word to the end. Christ is repeatedly to this day and in the bible referred to as the Tree of Life and satan is , was and always will be referred to as the tree of the knowledge of evil!!! Get your facts straight before you slander a good man’s name and doctrine.

  191. I have studied with pastor Arnold Murray for years as a critical Atheist. I am a fundamentalist Bible critic. My best debate is with a fundamentalist Clergy. If The God Murders website can assist Joel or others in their investigations, feel free to use it. It’s a work-in-progress that has been available on the internet for a few years. Last year it received 1.4 million hits. Regards, Gary DeVaney.

  192. He died of heart attack in 2013 His Name was Pastor David Murray. None of the three are false teachers of GODsS WORD. I guess some people will hold out to the very end when it is to late before they will hear the TRUE WORD OF GOD, not man.

  193. His name was David Murray. He died of a heart attack in 2013. They are NOT false in what they say unless You want to say GOD is false in what HE says In the 1611 King James Bible.

  194. David Murray was his name and he died of a heart attack in 2013. They are NOT false in what they say.

  195. The more virulent the attack, the greater the fear provoking it – why should anyone be so afraid of Pastor Murray? All you self-proclaimed ‘scholars’ will never sway anyone who has earnestly studied with Pastor Murray and so can see the manipulation behind the ‘racist’ and ‘serpent seed’ captions you use to dissuade and alarm the ignorant and innocent. We know better than you what his teachings are in this regard, and they are not at all as you present them. Thank God for a Pastor who taught the Truth in all its subtleties and complexities, who encouraged a personal relationship with God beyond any Pastor. Thank God for Shepherd’s Chapel. Pastor’s teachings are not so simplistic as you pretend and encompass a breadth and depth his critics know will prove them wrong should they truly explore them. He preached loving obedience to God’s will, discernment in our study of God’s Word and our interactions with the world, and the hard work of responsibility vs. Sunday forgiveness for a sin-again week. We celebrate the life of this great teacher who was also, yes, human, which is why he insisted his students do their own research rather than taking the word of any man for anything. Pastor Murray never lied nor led anyone astray, he served God and God’s children devotedly and humbly all his life, and Dennis will do the same, Praise Jesus! Nothing you say, no lie, no matter how alarmist or wicked, can change the Truth of Pastor Arnold Murray’s service to his congregation around the world. But if it makes you feel important, if you think you can misdirect folks with your sound and fury signifying nothing, why, you just keep on shouting, while we keep on studying.

  196. Pastor Murray is the best. He backs his statements with scripture. People are hungry for the meat from the scriptures instead of milk taught by most churches today.

  197. Everyone backs their statements with Scripture. Everyone. Murray is no different than abusing Scripture and others

  198. He says say, not Satan, i thought the same thing for a little bit, luckily i had a DVR system, and im starting to really realize any one who criticizes Dr. Murry is just ignorant

  199. Please post the link to this sermon. I have a dear friend who is in this to her eyeballs.

  200. Thomas, What was the title of thissermon? I have to hear this 4 myself. Thanks Brian thompson

  201. The “tree” is refered to as the tree of knowledge of GOOD and evil, GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT.

  202. I would like to see a biblical debate between Murray and say, Johnathan Burris and Johnathan Cahn, two Messianic Jews, NOT KENITES, but men that were Rabbi’s then became saved by the shed blood of Jesus. I so doubt that your really stupid pastor would do so, as stupidly arrogant that he is. He is one of the false teachers warned about in the Bible, to come in the end times. Do your self a favor and GET SAVED.

  203. Thank you for being smart enough to understand GODS holy word.
    If eve was the actule momma she would still be having babies
    Do people not believe that our Heavenly Father has the whole world
    Full of different races.

  204. Rhonda, I am a member of Shepherds chapel and i appreciate your support. It seems like, and it was prophesied, that people would reject the truth just as they did n Jesus’s time. They still do today . The more truth the more rejection and persecution and just look at what they say about Pastors Arnold and Dennis. I hope they give Arnold some slack now he is with the lord but his recordings will be on and people will not know he has passed and will still keep on bashing him. There is one truth and folks r going to find it out real soon that they should have listened. The Lord would not have let the Shepherds Chapel prosper as it did if they were teaching false doctrine. thanks brian thompson

  205. God Bless Sister, God blinded His sodish children and gave them no ears to hear, for he new if they heard: they would be held accountable. That’s why there is the Millennium maybe we can save some.

  206. Honey, any one who critisizes Murray is NOT ignorant. The ones that follow him are ignorant of Gods Word.

  207. Except that the criticism isn’t coming fropm the secular world, it’s coming from TRUE Christians, which your pastor is not. YOU are the parrots, reoeating and defending this completely false doctrine. Remember, God said that for those who would believe a ie, He would suppy one. That’s you and Murray.

  208. Genesis 3:13 And the Lord God said unto the woman, What is this that thou hast done? And the woman said, The serpent beguiled me, and I did eat.

    “beguile”: in Hebrew:nasha’ naw-shaw’ a primitive root; to lead astray, i.e. (mentally) to delude, or (morally) to seduce:–beguile, deceive, X greatly, X utterly
    2 Corinthians 11:3 But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.

    in Greek:exapatao ex-ap-at-ah’-o from 1537 and 538; to seduce wholly:–beguile, deceive
    “subtilty”. in Greek: panourgia pan-oorg-ee’-ah from 3835; adroitness, i.e. (in a bad sense) trickery or sophistry:–(cunning) craftiness, subtilty.

  209. oh poor little lost minded person you and your poor little minded persons know nothing about nothing that why you can’t come up with anything better to write about and he is not the church of Jesus Christ how little you know so sorry for you

  210. Why would a man of God knowingly mock those who follow our Father? Joel L Watts, you are a man of God, are you not? Have you not studied our Fathers’ Word? Yet you mock those who comment here; not teaching them with understanding but laughing at their devotion to their teacher and the conviction of their faith. I came here to learn something about your views. That is exactly what happened.

  211. I have great doubt about u Joel. I just ,by your comments about the Murrays, wonder what u really are. What brought on your hatred of the Murrays. It seems u have a personal vendetta against them. Come on tell us what they done to u,come on,come on tell us and we might understand just a little. Its every time I look at this site it is some more bashing of them. Why dont u bash non christian religeons instead of causing trouble n the Christian world.

  212. You mean ‘heretic’? Actually, all Protestants are heretics, sorry to burst your bubble4.

  213. Done enough in my life. But if you are going to be obsessed with this family, at least get the facts straight.

  214. I too, was glad I found someone that taught the Bible verse by verse and chapter by chapter. Soon into the lectures I realized their prayer was not sincere. I was taught to bow my head and close my eyes to pray. They never do, they just hurry to get it over with. I think maby some of what they say may be true but, for the most part, I think I will stick with what I was taught at a young age. “You come to the Father by the blood of Jesus Christ”. Believe in Jesus with all your heart and ye shall be saved. And, I do. One more thing. However it goes in the end, we better be ready and so should paster Murry. God help him if he is not.

  215. You’re welcome. Check out The God Murders website The Atheist Maker page. Also: Did Jesus Christ Lie?

  216. Steve, Hum, all protestants r heretics. Just what is your religeous persuasion ? I need 2 know before I comment any further. I think I know anyway but tell me first. Brian Thompson

  217. Joel, None of them claimed to b prophets. The last prophet was John the Baptist. If you think The Murrays r false teachers. I would like to hear your teachings and By your hatred of Shepherds Chapel I say u sir would b the false teacher!

  218. Are u laughing at Pastor Murrays death and being sarcastic on top of that. Are you even a Christian sir. You r one that Jesus talked about as to not casting your pearls before swine!

  219. I agree with you Maria Bender, I watched the Shepherd’s Chapel program for over a year after I came off active duty from the army, This story is no where near the truth! I am not sure if this person is just confused or mad at Arnold Murray, but either way It’s not polite or right to be gossiping horrible things about some one with out hard physical evidence! And one thing the teachers of Shepherds Chapel always stress to there listeners is not to believe man but to look it up your self! And I couldn’t agree more with that! From what I understand that is just what Jesus wanted to, when ever people asked Jesus questions, he would reply something like haven’t you read it your self?

  220. Those without the depth to truly teach, those too shallow in the demands of their own egos to be effective, bring attention to themselves by attacking and mocking their superiors. Denigrating the Truth makes it no less The Truth. Watts knows nothing he can say or write has any power of God’s truth, as Pastor Murray does, but you’ve got to sell that book somehow, eh? LoL! Sound and fury signifying nothing, insult and rudeness when you have no credible answers, no moral or scholarly authority and definitely no humility nor the ability to engage in scholarly discourse and thus advance God’s Word and not your own pitiable need to feel superior. Try Shepherd’s Chapel if you really want to explore The Word vs. this guy using your ignorance to justify himself. Learn from a teacher, not a salesman.

  221. bhahahhahahahahah bhahhahhahaha bhhhaaaaaa

    Murray is facing God at the moment, and no doubt will spend a considerable amount of time in hell, having his sins burned away.

  222. Dude, I know you can’t help yourself, but I expect anyone reading this understands you’ve just proven my point for me.

  223. That was an even lamer response than I expected, and once again proves my point. Do you read the comments, or just refer to a list of standard insults? No one who reads my comments will find anywhere in it any belief in Pastor as God, you poor dear. You go ahead and ‘play’ while we keep studying.

  224. umm… look at the way you referred to the dead guy as “Pastor”, complete with a capitalized “P”, present tense, and without a reference (the/a).

  225. Really? A capital letter is your criticism? LoL!! You Keep Proving My Point For Me!

  226. To quote you, ‘Hahahahahahahaha!!!’ Lovely to have you keep confirming my point! My work here is done except to invite anyone truly in love with God’s Word and willing to do the beautiful work to join the students at Shepherd’s Chapel and discover for yourselves what a real teacher is. Buh-bye, Watts, you made it so easy!

  227. You and God’s Word are acquainted only as the latter serves your ego; no man purporting to teach’ God’s Word spends all his time denigrating others who are sincerely doing only that, nor mocking all who know better than to give credence to your empty words. Again, as Pastor Arnold Murray, and now Pastor Dennis Murray, have always said, do the work for yourselves and let no man, even those worthy Pastors themselves, lead your heart and spirit, Selah! In God’s Love, Joel, mistaken as you are.

  228. Glad you know that much; there’s hope for you yet if you keep that uppermost and serve Jesus vs. ytour own ego, a lesson the humble Pastors of Shepherd’s Chapel teach by example. They refrain from judging other teachers and instead focus on bringing Jesus (The Living Word) to Life in our lives by giving their students the tools to accurate study and thereafter trusting God to gather them in. If only one reads this exchange and decides to find the Truth for themselves, I’m content that Truth will lead them rightly. So in this forum, dear Joel, negative and judgmental and valueless to God’s Word as you are, I guess you DO serve Jesus after all! Love His sense of humor … God Bless you.

  229. “refrain from judging others”

    Let’s see- “Anglo-Saxons are the chosen race, and America and Great Britain are the lost tribes of the children of Israel.”

    Um…. not only is that racist, but that’s simply wrong.

    “If you believe in a literal 7 day creation you’re on you’re way to hell.”

    Granted, Young Earth Creationism is a lie, but it doesn’t send you to hell. Further, this is a judgmental statement.

    Murray is a racist nutter who is bat crap crazy.

    And here… http://www.deceptioninthechurch.com/arnoldmurray.html

  230. Twist words’ til they scream, Watts, doesn’t drown out the Truth we who study for ourselves have learned. Try to put words in the mouths of your critics to give yourself something to rail against, but that bitter fruit is still yours, you’re only being your own straight man. You offer nothing of God or Christ, only petulant tantrums when your vitriol and shallow ‘scholastics’ fail to turn us from a proven teacher and man of God. Having spent too much time today on you, I am reminded that the Pastors Murray and Shepherd’s Chapel have never wasted a moment on naysayers, so while it’s been fun watching you spin and sputter, I’ve accomplished what I intended and can now absent myself from this silly site. Watts, thank you for serving Christ today even if not as you intended, by giving me a forum to extend a loving invitation to all curious and sincere students, all who trust God before any man, to visit Shepherd’s Chapel and find out for yourselves what Watts lies to keep you from. Ask why, with so many blatantly false and wicked teachers out there, Watts’ is so dedicated to this futile vendetta against Shepherd’s Chapel. What faction, whose servant, would work so vehemently to keep you from seeing for yourself, or from even believing yourself capable of righteous discernment? Check it out first-hand, Beloveds, and welcome!

  231. This must be a response to someone else since it has nothing to do with my comments, though I’ve noticed you ‘rebutt’ things no one has even mentioned, usually ending with a meaningless personal insult. While it might be fun to reply to your every response to me with another invite to your ‘readers’ to check out Shepherd’s Chapel for themselves, it’d be casting pearls into a void since there are so few, so it’s time to move on. Thanks for the opportunity to tell the Truth, and thanks for unwittingly proving my points for me. Love God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit, and learn the truth from the unadulterated Letter from God to His Beloveds, the Bible!

  232. Murray has never said that whites are the chosen ones and that the u.s. and england are the the lost two tribes of israel. He said that the ten tribes fled the assyrians and migrated across the caucasus mts. and settled all of europe, and some eventually settled in north america. He also taught that God created ALL races and was happy with ALL of them each distincitively different but ALL distinctively NOBLE! not like this lunatic liar Dudley who has spewed lies on this blog like yourself stating Murray says blacks are a subhuman creature, created before the white race. Total lies; and any one can verify the truth of what I write by tuning in to the chapel on dish or direct t.v. I watched him from 1994 to present until his death in feb. everything he taught and said can be documented via 17 hours a day of video five days a week and on the website sat. and sun. You are an absolute liar and hater, I wish I could have five minutes alone with you but the Father will take care of you!

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